Category: Podcast Episode

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

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Our guests for this episode is Bruce Rosenthal. Bruce is a corporate partnerships strategist, consultant, and educator. He specializes in associations and not for profit organizations, Bruce is dedicated to boosting revenue enhancing member value and promoting organizational sustainability. The Bruce, I’m excited to have you with us today here on chamber chat podcast that bio as concise as it is, I’m hoping pique the interest of everybody listening, that how we can bring more revenue into our chambers, but wanted to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the chamber champions that are listening and to share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to

Bruce Rosenthal 1:53
know you a little better. All right, thank you, Brandon, and excited about being here. So So an interesting fact that I’ve worked throughout my career for nonprofit organizations. Though, when I was when I was growing up, my dad and his brother had an insurance agency. And when I was in college, I was here in the Washington DC area. And they were in the Chicago area and, and my uncle was a senior partner in the firm invited me over and said, Bruce, we have an idea, all the kids are going to go into the insurance business. And I was here as a sophomore in college and all the political buzz and everything in DC and I still to this day, hope I wasn’t too rude to him by saying I’m here on spring break. But I’m going back to DC and I don’t think I’m going into the insurance business. So sorry to all of you who are thriving based on doing great things for businesses in your communities. I didn’t go into business, I went into the not for profit. But for the conversation today how we can take what I’ve learned over the years to help your your chambers grow. Yeah,

Brandon Burton 2:53
it’s always fun when somebody has a great idea for you. And here’s your path for you. Right. Right. Right. Great. Well, tell us a little bit about your company Rosen Bruce Rosenthal associates with the work that you do kind of we know nonprofits and associations, but kind of in a nutshell, what do you do these give

Bruce Rosenthal 3:15
you the brief history, it does go back about 15 years, but it’s not that long a story. I was working for National Association on not a sponsorship project. But the association completely revamped its sponsorship program because I realized the times were changing and needed to keep up with the trends and the revenue was really important. It was about 15 18% of the revenue the association was bringing in. So they did that complete revamp one of the components of the new sponsorship program was the senior level staff person to run the program. So the CEO asked me to be that person, I said, Be glad to run the sponsorship program. Got all signed up and got my desk set up. That was 2009 2010 just as the economy tanked. So we had some companies that were that were top level sponsors and a new program pricey a sponsorship program around and I knew there were some companies where we’re gonna get it going to get no new business from our members in the next couple of years because of the economy. So in hindsight, the good news is that kind of set me on the path, what are the real value propositions? What are companies really looking for? Why do they sponsor and the good news is we were able to keep all of the companies in the fold as the economy, the economy slumped, and then came back. And what we realized as part of that process is the companies were really interested less than less than that transactional, or as the CEO said to me at that time, when we want to move their program from the transactional to the transformational, and kind of the standard gold, silver, bronze logo, visibility, recognition, shout out from the podium. In fact, there was one company at that time when I was asking him for their their logo for our newsletter, and he said, Bruce, we’ve been a sponsor for 20 years. Everybody knows who we are. We don’t need our logo on your newsletter, and we definitely don’t need their logo next to five other sponsors. is in your newsletter. So, so we created a program that was that we’ll talk about today, there was much more what I call it marketing agency approach to really sitting down with companies. What do you need? How can we be helpful? Our association has audiences, we have communications channels, we have education opportunities, how can we truly partner with your company to be part of that process?

Brandon Burton 5:22
I like that, yeah, this is going to this is going to be one of those episodes where people are going to want to go back and listen to again, or take notes and present their board and say, here’s a new strategy of how we might want to approach sponsorships going forward. Right. So actually,

Bruce Rosenthal 5:39
just to put a cap on that, Brandon. So when I left that association, about seven years ago, I took what I had learned and in those six years building and revamping the program and and now is you net noted in the bio working as an advisor, an educator to Association on how I can take what I learned in that kind of deep dive with one association and now with seven years of experience with a whole range of organizations, different sizes, inside staff, on how there are opportunities for all of them to grow sponsorship revenue. Right.

Brandon Burton 6:10
So our topic for discussion today is you might have guessed it, it’s around improving corporate sponsorships. Bruce and I were talking before we hit record, were just a little bit about the uniqueness of chambers of commerce and, and we’ve all heard the line if you’ve seen one chamber, you’ve seen one chamber but I think one thing that is common amongst all chambers is that chambers rely on sponsorships to help fund their organization and their mission and envision to move things forward in their community. So it’s gonna be a lot of value in this discussion today. And I’m excited to dive into it much deeper as soon as we get back from this quick break.

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All right, Bruce, we’re back. So we’re diving into corporate sponsorships today and for chambers in particular to improve these opportunities for sponsorships. So what are some of these lessons, I guess that you’ve learned through your own experience, but also working with organizations on their sponsorship programs? I’m sure there’s been some things that have lights that have gone off in your own mind. Some notes that you’ve taken and experiences that are valuable to share.

Bruce Rosenthal 9:17
You know, the first thing so So back when I was working with that association, the economy tanked. I wasn’t sure if we were gonna keep these companies in the fold. So I brought in a consultant, I said, Could you interview our top 10 year long corporate partners, and all of the things we talked about today can be scaled. So some organizations might have two sponsors, some might have 10 or 15. So everything I say I might throw out some numbers, but that everything can be easily scaled up or down. So I brought in a consultant and she interviewed the top 10 corporate partners, and she came in to do this presentation and I was sitting next to our CEO and and some other senior staff folks. And she said the good news is all of your corporate partners said exactly the same thing. And I’m thinking that is great. You She said, however, what they are looking for is not what you’re offering. So I have interviewed along with my team, hundreds of companies over the last 15 years, and whether they are sponsors of small organizations, large organizations, whether they sell, technology, insurance, marketing, whether it’s a bank, whatever it is, they all pretty much have the same three reasons that they sponsor organizations. And those three reasons are, of course, they want new business. But that’s not the only reason. The second is they want some sort of brand elbow room. So not necessarily exclusivity, they don’t necessarily need to be the only sure insurance company that’s sponsoring or the only marketing agency that’s sponsoring the chamber. But they want some sort of recognition that among all of the the insurance companies of all the insurance companies that might be involved with the chamber, there’s something different or special about that one, that’s a sponsor. And the third one, which is really key is they want to be positioned as a knowledge leader. So they want to be known for their expertise. So going back to the comment I made earlier, there was a company that came two years ago and said, We don’t need a logo placement. Everybody knows who we are. It was a bank. And it was one of six banks, who was a sponsor of the organization. What made that one bank different? And it wasn’t just around the money, it was, how could they help members more how, what are some case studies of how they help members finance a new building, for example. So those three, those three value propositions are closely related. Because if we can actually start with Thought Leadership, and help organization help sponsors be on an education panel, or a podcast or webinar panel, or, or develop an article or white paper for Chamber members, if that company can be positioned as a thought leader, that checks off the box, the brand visibility, because they’re being known for something, and that will eventually lead to business development. And because that will differentiate them as having expertise doesn’t mean everybody’s going to buy from them. But as I’ve talked to companies, and ask them how they measure success, and how this plays out, they’ll say, Oh, so many people went to this webinar, we followed up with that, we were able to schedule 10 meetings, and that led to three contract proposals. And that led to one signed contract, that one contract paid the cost of the sponsorship, that was our win. So companies have three those three reasons. Among those reasons, I did not mention logo visibility, recreation, or a shout out from the podium. So I think the two challenges and what many of us in the association and chamber nonprofit world have done for years as we’ve gone out to companies with a kind of a prospectus of gold, silver bronze sponsorships for our conference. And we’ve said two things, we need money. Well, spoiler alert, that companies in many cases don’t care that we need money, because that’s not one of their main drivers. And we’ll talk about one exception to that later. But for the most part, they don’t need money. And we’re trying to sell them. Visibility recognition is shut off from the podium, and most of them don’t need that. And I would think, especially within the chamber area, whether it’s a small town is bigger city, probably these companies are fairly well known and don’t need another logo placement. So we’ve been trying to sell them something. And this has been for decades, or a bigger exhibit booth. The other challenge with what we’re trying to sell them as we’re usually selling them, or in many cases, we’re selling them a conference sponsorship. And there was a company I was interviewing, interviewing a couple years ago. And they said, Well, you know, the reality is Bruce is a fantastic conference three days, we get a lot of leads, a lot of folks come by our booth, we get a lot of business cards, it’s three days, our company markets 365 days a year, right? So even with a little pre and post conference visibility, how can we work with the association throughout the year doesn’t mean every day. But Can there be something like a podcast in the first quarter and a webinar on the second quarter and an article in the third quarter and the conference in the fourth quarter? Because as we all know, kind of the the the marketing maxim is that people need to see a message seven times before it resonates. So we need to help companies get visibility as thought leaders throughout the year and that’s when the companies began to really see the

Brandon Burton 14:31
value. And I liked the point about being a thought leader and correlating that to the logo on the newsletter. The logo on the newsletter almost cheapens the experience of being a thought leader. Because if you’re coming to the table as being that thought leader, the assumption is everybody knows who your company is, anyway, that’s why they’re asking you for your expertise on whatever the topic may be. And just throwing a logo on a newsletter without any context around it doesn’t really it I don’t know, I think I think it cheapens the experience a little bit.

Bruce Rosenthal 15:03
Right. But I and and I think right, and the key there is use it in context. So yes, sure. After you’ve done the webinar and the podcast and all of that, then to say, oh, and the logo. Oh, yeah, that would be a good add on. So it’s a great add on in context. But yeah, if most of the benefits are logo visibility, recognition, that’s when companies are like, we don’t need that. And the other challenge now it’s it’s a very competitive environment out there. And there was a corporate sponsor that I was talking to, recently for an association client. And and they said, actually, you know, I think in that case was like a $30,000. Sponsorship, they said, we get more business leads from $3,000 of Google ads, that from a $30,000 sponsorship. Yeah. So the game changer in the last few years, especially with the pandemic, people can sit in front of a zoom screen and get a message anytime they can. People see Google ads. So So that’s part of the competition. And I think often we’ve not thought about this as competition, we thought, well, we’re the only chamber in town or we’re the only whatever Association around, companies really want to come to us. And to some extent, that used to be true when I was working at that association, 10 years ago, and a company would come to us and said, well, we want to be positioned as knowing about, you know, how to finance buildings, or how to create websites, or whatever. And I’d say, Well, here’s the list of all the things you need to do. We have a webinar series, we can get you on the calendar in six months. And we have a conference, if you submit this five page proposal, maybe we can get you on the program. And now that post pandemic lockdown, we all know how to sit in front of a zoom screen and sign up for a webinar and check that little box on the webinar sign up that says you can use our name to contact us afterwards. All of a sudden companies are like, well, we’d like to affiliate with your chamber, we’d like to be part of your program. But if you’re going to make it too difficult, we as a company can go out there and put out our webinar in the next six weeks. And then we can you know, have access to the registration list and all that. So when companies are making choices than doing it on their own versus going through the chamber, that’s we need to think about what is the value proposition that we’re offering to those companies? Right?

Brandon Burton 17:24
So on the topic of competition, are there other areas of competition? You mentioned Google and the technology side, Google and Facebook, and where you can purchase ads for a fraction of what it might cost to sponsor a major competition?

Bruce Rosenthal 17:40
Competition? That is a great question, Brandon. And when I started a consulting seven years ago, and I would do competitive in that analysis for Association and organization clients, and you know, I would come up with a list of your five, six other associations that are kind of in the similar space to you. And now I’m coming up a list 40 5060 organizations, and because I’m looking at it from the company standpoint, and what I saw, and some of this comes about when I interviewed corporate partners, and I’ll say, where else are you exhibiting? Where else are you sponsoring? Where else are you advertising? So I’m hearing that not only similar organizations, and then also organizations in other trades and professions? So again, kind of back to the example of the insurance agent who might be interested in sponsoring the chamber. Are there other places in time zero retail association in the town or the state where that company might be interested in sponsoring, so all of a sudden now the retail Association is a competitor to the chamber? Or is there a Healthcare Association where the company could say, well, we wouldn’t have access to all these prospective buyers of our insurance product if we sponsored the Health Care Association or the hospital association. So there are those associations. There are an increasing number of for profit, especially on the state and national level for profit entities that are putting out webinars doing expos doing podcasts. And some companies are going that direction and reaching out to those entities. And I think among the biggest competitors, kind of the example I mentioned earlier, companies just doing their own webinars, yeah, within their own and that, you know, they used to be called kind of, you know, user group meetings and they were very techie and but now companies are realizing something that I learned from a an association Education Director a few years ago, the idea of educating the sell, not selling to educate so if companies either through the chamber or on their own can educate members with the idea that then they will gain some sales leads, that tends to be more successful than going out there and saying, Oh, we’re gonna go out there and get x number of sales leads. Yeah,

Brandon Burton 19:54
and I think this hits on an important point because there’s a The money for these things for sponsorships versus advertising could come from very different budgets. But when you look at a company like I’m thinking an example of a hospital, a hospital may be a major sponsor for a chamber for their annual banquet or just overall with their, you know, the highest tier membership program, but their your, your top sponsor, talk to your sponsor, but they could also use that several $1,000 and do a health fair in the parking lot of their hospital and it’s their own thing, and they draw their own crowd in. So being able to differentiate what’s your value proposition as a chamber? What sets us apart? Why do you want to associate with us as a chamber? What making it clear what the mission is of your chamber, the advocacy efforts that you’re involved with all the different benefits? Beyond, you know, you get your logo here, or we have this networking mixer in this, like, really, you got to set yourself apart? Because those dollars are competitive on where they’re going?

Bruce Rosenthal 21:05
Yep, absolutely. It’s, it’s, and I think that’s a good way to frame it, Brandon, that’s to start off by saying, yeah, there’s nothing wrong with our chamber. But let’s think of our chamber is not, not sole source, not the only game in town, there is competition. And let’s just embrace that, and have conversations with companies. And I found a great starting point and a great differentiator, instead of as we’ve done for many decades, and you know, chambers are special and unique and in a variety of ways. From the company standpoint, it’s just another organization asking for money. So, again, no disrespect to chambers, but from the when I talked to companies, and they say, we get 612 15 Different prospectuses to sponsor conferences, every mods, and they put them all in the same category. And unfortunately, sometimes that category is, is the Delete box or the wastebasket, because it just they all begin to look the same. And so many of them start off with, we need money, our members will be eternally grateful, because in London, right, our registration fees, and again, companies, it’s like, well, how does that help my company? So I think one great strategy, as organizations chambers, think about revamping your sponsorship program, schedule a meeting with a few of the companies that have been sponsors in the past, or who are bigger exhibitors that your conferences and events and have a conversation with them and not to sell anything. And I found by scheduling those calls with companies and starting off by saying, I have no prospectus here. I’m not selling anything today, I want to talk about your company. And all of a sudden, and I do a lot of these on Zoom, but all of a sudden, they become available. Yeah, cell phones go down, the pins go down. It’s like, read Bruce, that’s, let’s talk about that. And just ask questions. You know, what are your company’s business goals? What are your marketing goals, and to try to focus it not on tactics. So if the company were to say, as some will, oh, our tactic, we want an email list of all the Chamber members? Well, that’s a tactic. That’s nice. Let’s put that to the side for a minute. Tell us about your company’s goals. Because what we want to do is position and this can work whether the chamber has one staff person, or dozens of staff, people or anywhere in between, to help the company solve those problems. Because if we can come in as a problem solver, and not just someone else asking for money that we grew that month, that becomes a differentiator. So I’ve had companies, including companies that sponsor nationally and internationally say, we have been sponsoring, you know, we sponsor 50 Different organizations every year, nobody’s ever asked us what our business goals are. And in some cases, these are companies that are $100,000 sponsors, and that’s when you begin to think, are they going to continue being a sponsor, because, again, the competition, the other competition, that kind of ties in with social media is that companies can create their own lists now. So one of my colleagues was talking to a company and, again, we’ll scale this up to the national level, the company had a online community of 10,000 members of that association, that they had just nurtured over the last six, mostly since COVID, over the last couple years, by putting information on LinkedIn downloads of white papers, webinar attendees, and the company said, Well, now that we think about it kind of begs the question, do I need to be a sponsor of the association? Because I already have a list of 10,000 professionals in that space. So I think, again, I think that can be scaled down to the local level and chamber level also, companies can create their own lists, and they can reach me they can reach and teach through social media and zoom without the chamber being involved. Oh, no, I think it’s also important to add to that, that the big one of those those key value propositions that associate the Chamber’s have to offer is the brand affinity. So while those companies can go off out and do their own webinars and offer their white papers to do that, to co brand that to do it in conjunction with the chamber, I think is a huge plus and a great reason that companies would want to affiliate. Right.

Brandon Burton 25:28
And I think that goes right along with asking the right questions. So when you’re talking to these corporate sponsors, or potential past sponsors, or potential sponsors to be able to ask the right questions, see what their motives are See, those top three reasons of why businesses sponsor, where do they fall? And then what aligns best with their needs. Now, I’m curious, as far as a, for lack of a better term, a sponsorship package? Do you go in with a package? Or do you assess the needs and then create a sponsorship opportunity to fit the needs? Or what? What type of approach should chambers considers they have these conversations? And just how do they start the conversation at some of these businesses? Yeah, great, great

Bruce Rosenthal 26:17
question on what to offer. So I don’t do packages we. So I often start and chamber can do this on their own with their their staff, or they’re more thinking about what do we have to offer? What are the different communications channels? Do we have newsletters, conferences, podcasts? who are who are our audience? What who is our audience? And also can that audience be segmented? So if it’s a company that wants to reach folks based on a certain type of business, do they want to be retailers? Do they want to reach construction firms or whatever it is, because what I also find that in many cases, companies, and this is also an interesting model to think about on the national level. And Association says we have 20,000 members, you can reach 20,000, folks, we have 10,000, folks that come to our conference, and then I’ll talk to a company and they’ll say, Well, based on what we’re selling, we really want to reach 300 people, how do we find those 300 Out of the 10,000 at the conference with a 20,000? Membership. So this is a great example, I think it’s for chamber, smaller chambers, when you can segment the membership to reach the folks that each company wants to reach. But I usually start by thinking what are all the things that we could offer. And then to have that exploratory call with a company or two. And again, this is where it can easily be scaled. If you have a small staff reach out to one or two companies among if you have a larger staff, it’s like, well, let’s talk to a couple of companies a week, and to have these exploratory calls. And then kind of to go back to the office and sit down and say okay, so based on what the company said their goals and objectives are, what do we have to offer the word fulfill those goals. And that’s a very different approach than usual. Here’s a standard gold, silver bronze, because again, I’m talking to more and more companies that say as soon as they see gold, silver, bronze, delete, yeah, because it means everybody’s getting the same thing. So this model, which I think a lot of businesses should be able to appreciate, is much is very much what I call a marketing agency model. Because if any of us goes to a marketing agency, either the chamber or one of your members goes to a marketing agency, and says I need help marketing agencies don’t have gold silver bronze packages. And from a couple experiences I had with a marketing agency, the marketing agency asked me questions for an hour similar to these exploratory calls we were talking about a few minutes ago about what is your product? What is your service? Who is your competition? What are you trying to accomplish? Who do you sell to? Do you want to reach a segment of the market? And then at the end of that conversation with a marketing agency, I said, what can you do for us? And they said, we will schedule a meeting for you next week, because we’re going to take all this information, and we’re going to think about it. And we’re going to come back to you with a series of solutions, services, or what we would call in the chamber space benefits. What can you offer and it’s going to be different for every company that does they can complicate it. In a way when I talked to associations that implement that model, they actually find it easier than having 20 companies that all they everybody gets a logo placement and everybody get this there. It becomes very assembly line ish, which is a lot of moving pieces. And kind of back to your comment earlier. Brandon is logo placement even worth it? Maybe not. So sometimes you come up with here are two or three big things we could do with the company during the year as part of the customized year long. So there’s kind of the two key things companies are looking for customized in many cases year long. And if we can come back to them with solutions, that’s when we see sponsorship fees, that in some cases are 510 times more than what they paid in the past because also sometimes in the past I see paid for a lot of pieces. So I think also if one, were going to talk to a company, as a company been an exhibitor and an advertiser and bought an ad and our gala program, what are all the things they spend money on, and realize that well, that’s kind of the minimum of what they would pay. And if they actually came in with a solution to their challenges, we can probably charge a lot more.

Brandon Burton 30:20
So when I think of a chamber making this approach, and this is going to come to the responsibilities, I guess, with the staff members or board members who might be involved, but so over the last, we’ll say, I don’t know, six or eight years, there’s been a big trend for chambers to go to a tiered dues membership model. So you’ve got your basic membership that gives you access to certain things, you get the next tier and you get other benefits, and it keeps going up see gold, silver, bronze, yeah, like you’re talking about. And these chambers typically will have a membership director that’s there. They’re doing a membership sales are attracting new businesses. And I know there’s other chambers that take an approach specifically for sponsorships where they’ll do what they call a one ask. So once a year, they’ll go out to some of the bigger players in the community. And typically, it’s the chamber CEO or Executive Director that will go and meet with these, these larger companies and potential donors and have that one on one conversation and say, here’s everything that we have to offer. In our case, I’m not really sure how to ask this question, because I’m thinking there’s just such a variety of how chambers approached us and come to it. What’s the least messiest way to way to approach membership and sponsorships? In at the same time, or should it be separate? Or is there a way to do it together?

Bruce Rosenthal 31:59
Well, there are probably ways to do it together. And each chamber does their members the best. And if it’s a company that kind of makes it as a joint decision, but a couple thoughts come to mind. One is that I also often find with the big year law, corporate partners, useful to find out when they make that decision each year. Yeah. So whether it’s 10,000, or 110,000, or a half a million, that I’ve had experiences of going to companies and saying, oh, based on our organization’s fiscal year, here’s where we want to talk to you. And the company says, Well, I wish we had talked two months ago, because we set our budget two months ago for the coming year. Let’s talk next year. So if it’s going to be a bigger sponsorship discussion, I think useful to find out months or even what the company’s fiscal year is, when do they actually put pencil to paper and start? We’re working on the budget.

And I think the there was another thought I had as part of that, which I don’t recall right now. So it will come back to me. So

Brandon Burton 32:55
maybe it had to do with the membership side of it with aside from the sponsorship?

Bruce Rosenthal 33:01
Yeah, I think, again, it depends on each organization and how you’re approaching that. But I think it’s again, asking companies the question about what what are their? Well, I think you also mentioned kind of going in with with either packages I go in with with no paper, I can tell them nothing about the benefits, even if they start to say what is the circulation of the magazine? How many people attend the conference? It’s like, well, let’s talk about your business goals. And we will get back to you. Because I think once we start going down that rabbit hole of talking about for tactical things, we lose the discussion. I think the other conversation that can be a little different for her chambers is there is kind of this other pot of money, which which some companies have the chambers have been asked accessing. And that’s one of the corporate social responsibilities. So that’s hospitals, for example, that are supporting the chamber, not because they think they’ll get more patients or doctors to come to the hospital, because they believe it’s the right thing to do for the community. And so I think, you know, when you’re reaching out to companies and asking questions, like What is your decision making budget here? But also asking him Do you have a separate department that’s in charge of corporate social responsibility, because all of us are going on to those marketing folks. And whether it’s with that insurance brokerage agency or, or with the hospital, and we’re all going to the marketing folks ask them for money from from their small pot at the same time. And the opportunity with this what’s often called Corporate Social Responsibility, money that hospitals in some larger businesses have retail stores and others is that it’s everybody’s not asking for that money at the same time. So it’s a little easier to being lost in the shuffle there. And it’s a somewhat different criteria. The marketing folks are back to thinking what is the ROI am I going to get X number of new contracts or X number of new customers? If I support the chamber in this way At, or the hospital is like, well, we’ve seen the Chamber’s impact statement. You guys are doing great stuff. We want to support you. So I think it’s different conversations but similar, because I think there is always an advantage in having these exploratory calls, and showing empathy and interests. And wow, tell me more about those goals, whether they be sales goals or intellectual responsibility. Tell me about your goals, what’s working, what’s not working? What are the barriers? And that’s what I just find that I’ve had companies, I’m shocked, I’d never heard of this in the sales. And because we’re still basically kind of selling sponsorships, where companies will say, at the end of the call, wow, this was a great call, can we schedule another call, we didn’t get to cover it all in a half hour. And then I talked to kind of folks that are have expertise in sales, and they’re like, schedule 15 minute sales calls, you should be able to get it all done in 15 minutes. So I think when we bring companies in, and this is where we kind of shift from, I have a slide in some of my PowerPoints is that the word partner is a noun and a verb. And we often talk about corporate partners, oh, they’re our partner. But do we truly partner with them using partners as a verb, so when we can bring companies in. And we did talk about things since the beginning of this conversation about the revenue, which is definitely important, but there’s also a huge component around member value. So another way to kind of shift the way we’ve done things in the past, is to actually start with not even a conversation with companies. But what is the chamber need? What are our members need, and I have not found any association and the surveys back this up, including associations with 100 200, staff, people, nobody has enough staff time expertise or money to meet all of the members needs all the time. Right? So do Chamber members need to have new information on cybersecurity? Are women in leadership capacities, or D AI are? And then to go to companies and say, Well, you know, our members really need information about cybersecurity, could we partner with your company, to take some of your company’s expertise, not a sales pitch, and we don’t want to hear about your specific products, position, your company has that knowledge leader around cybersecurity, and do a series of webinars, podcasts, white papers, something as the conference during the year, and really position your company for success. So then you’re bringing in not only the revenue for the chamber, you’re bringing in information for members. So then you kind of tie that into membership recruitment, when you’re going out to recruit members, oh, we have this great year long education program around cybersecurity, because we heard this as what businesses in town really need, or whatever the topic is, but actually start with what do members need? Can we find companies with that expertise? And that’s where I find calling companies and not saying, Oh, our convention is coming up, or a conference or Expo is coming up? And in 60 days, do you want to gold, silver bronze sponsorship a calling and saying our members really did it for information on cybersecurity, I looked at your company’s website, I did some research, did some work on my end. So that your company as you know, some white papers and some videos about cybersecurity, can we talk? Those are the calls that get returned? And those are the meetings we can put together.

Brandon Burton 38:11
Right? I like that question. A lot of great points there. One I wanted to circle back with was on the corporate social responsibility. For chambers listening. I know there’s been buzz lately, about chambers having foundations, a lot of chambers have established foundations. And that’s where you can really tap into some of those buckets of social responsibility for these companies where it’s not coming out of marketing funds, it’s a totally different bucket. But having, especially if a foundation is something new and there is buzz in your community about the foundation and the work that it will support, it’ll be easier to open those doors to be able to have those conversations. And in the end, it’s all supporting the mission of the organization. So

Bruce Rosenthal 38:56
Right. That’s, and that’s that’s a good point, just to underscore that, that every relationship that we’re talking about with companies, whether it’s from their marketing, budget, sponsorship, or corporate social responsibility, should always kind of meet the two major criteria in alignment with the Chamber’s mission in meeting the needs of members. Right. And it doesn’t work all the time. If a company says, Wow, what we really want, we need an email list of all your members, and we want our logo front and center on the Chamber’s website for the next year. It’s like, sorry, that that’s not going to work. Yeah. Let’s talk about some other things or less. Or

Brandon Burton 39:31
here’s what it’ll cost to do that right. Well.

Bruce Rosenthal 39:35
Sometimes we get on a slippery slope if we compromise ourselves. So I think it’s also fine in some cases to say this doesn’t look like it’ll work right now. Maybe we can get together in another few months and talk again. Because it we definitely want to make sure and I think also because sometimes boards are a little skeptical. What about sponsors? Are we endorsing products? Are we aligning with the wrong companies? It’s like, No, we have a set of guidelines and you Here’s how we can work with companies. And I think also by having these exploratory calls with companies and then going back to the companies with ideas, yeah, we’re sure that they’re in alignment with our mission and our members needs. Because we’ve developed it. We as chamber leaders have developed that not going to the companies and saying, What do you want? Because then they start telling you what they want. And then we’re like, Oh, what do we do now? Because we can’t do that. So when we can go to companies, and I think we there are even ways I turned it around if a company does come and say, We want to list your members. And I try not to say no, but I’ll say, well, that’s interesting. Tell me about your objectives and goals around that. Not I mentioned, you want to list but why do you want to list and I’ve had a number of instances where where I’ve realized as part of the discussion, they really don’t want to listen to everybody that just kind of what they’re used to asking for. They want to reach a segment, or they want to be positioned for their expertise, some something and I’ll say, well, well, what if we help you do a webinar? And we’ll only introduce Chamber members who are whatever retailers are in the health space? How would that work for your company? And more than nine times out of 10? They’ll say, oh, yeah, that’s a great solution. And they’ll never ask about the mailing list again. Yeah. So if we can find when we can find out what a company’s goals and objectives are. And then find ways to work with in the context of the Chamber’s mission and member needs. So offer solutions. That’s the real though I always look for the win, win win. Members. First, it’s got to meet the needs of members, chambers, Max, if it provides more revenue for the chamber, and then when we can position, the company, the sponsor is the third when then that’s when it’s successful. Yeah.

Brandon Burton 41:40
Now, this has been some gold nuggets all over the place. So as we, as we start to wrap up here, Bruce, I wanted to ask for chambers listening who are interested in taking their organization to the next level, what kind of tip or action item might you leave with them and trying to accomplish that goal? I’d

Bruce Rosenthal 42:02
say that for action steps, the first would be have conversations with companies. And based on your size and capacity, it could be reaching out to one or two companies start with the ones who have been supportive, or have had the, you know, bought the most number of ads during the year, whatever it is, however, you know, money’s always a good metric, the companies that have spent the most with the chamber, and it could be in terms of membership, as well as sponsorship and advertisers. And, and schedule a time to talk with them. And you might even start by saying we’re not selling anything today. Oh, and by the way, what’s what’s your budget year, we want to have this conversation when you’re working on your next budget, and have that conversation. And yet I find it as a huge differentiator, because most organizations aren’t doing that. And and then to kind of regroup internally and go back to the company and say, Well, we have some ideas and hard thing is often how do you price it but you know, look at what the company spent in the past. And, and you can probably increase it a significant amount. So I’ve seen organizations kind of on the national level, again, it can be scaled down. But companies, companies that have gone from a $5,000 conference sponsorship to the next year, a $40,000 year long partnership, because it has achieved. And I looked at one of the questions I may not have mentioned in these conversations with companies, ask them how they measure success. And they may be able to tell you, they may not. But again, I think it shows interest in empathy, because I’ve worked with companies like banks, where they say, Wait, if we get one new financial stake, this is finance financing as a result of his partnership with the chamber. that’ll pay the whole annual fee right there. Yeah. And if it’s a smaller marketing agency, they’re gonna say, wow, we’re gonna design a whole bunch of websites for local businesses to be able to pay for this sponsorship. So understanding who they want to reach and how they measure success. And I think most companies would be glad to answer that question. How do you measure success? And success should be in terms of, again, kind of objectives and results in that? You know, success is now we want the email list. So we can mail up, you know, 3000 brochures to your members or 500 brochures, who remembers that’s a tactic but, but what is kind of a business ROI success, and I also find companies are measuring a lot more than they used to. Yeah. And then they’re tracking every lead from the first conversation, the first touch point, the first downloadable white paper through the months until there’s a sale. So companies to a greater extent, I think this was partly just because we’re more data focused and things became more a lot online during the pandemic. Companies are measuring so I showing interest in empathy and saying, how do you measure how can we you know, if we have this Congress, if you become a sponsor, we come back over the months to talk about a renewal. What will be an indication of success for you and how can we help you with that? Right.

Brandon Burton 44:56
I like that. I like that question. With Bruce I A final question I like asking everybody that I have on the show is, as we look to the future of chambers of commerce, how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?

Bruce Rosenthal 45:10
I think for chambers and other nonprofit organizations, there’s a huge interest that companies have and companies are. Yeah, I think the opportunity for chambers that embrace a different sort of strategy for working with companies is has a lot of potential because I’ve talked to a lot of companies, and this is really over the last seven or eight years. So it’s not even specific to the pandemic, is that I’m talking to companies of all sizes, and they are saying, we are not cutting our sponsorship expenditures in the coming year. However, we’re cutting the number of organizations we sponsored by 30%. So again, that’s I don’t think there are too many companies that are going to be successful by cutting marketing budgets. So companies have a huge respect and want to support organizations and be aligned with the brand. So just one quick example, when I worked for an association, we had a year long corporate partner, they were sponsors of a major research study co branded with the Association. And what was interesting, the company did most of the research for that research study. And I looked at the different scenarios, and I thought, you know, they could decide to just publish that on their own. Yeah. Or they could co branded the reason they were like, and this is what will be at the scale it down to a smaller chamber level, but they were $160,000, sponsor of a national association. One of the key reasons they sponsored $460,000 was a co branding of that annual research study, which they did all the research they could have done around. So I think, you know, realizing that by having these engaging collaborative conversations with companies, bringing them in as partners is a huge differentiator, because companies value chambers, value, things like CO branding, being on panels, being invited as a thought leader, because I’ve talked to a lot of companies and associations I’ve worked with, and the company will say, you know, they call us a partner. But we’re a marketing agency. And I saw that the association did a webinar on marketing, and they never asked us to be on the panel. Yeah. Does it feel like a partner? Yeah. If I want to do that, I always said, Do you want our money? Or do you want our brains? Yeah. So kind of back to members need the information and the expertise. So again, if companies are going to be on that panel, they need to be coached, you’re not going to sell, you’re not going to put up your QR code. You can have that in the last slide or at the end or have a brochure if it’s in person to end at the end. But we want your expertise. Can you talk about marketing agency, how to design websites or how Chamber members can use LinkedIn or whatever without mentioning the name of your company that will be the educating to sell not selling to educate? So I think there’s huge potential because companies have sponsorship money to spend, but they’re going to spend it on fewer organizations where they

Brandon Burton 48:05
see value. Yeah, absolutely. But Bruce, I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for listeners who might want to reach out and connect or learn more about some of this that you shared today or just dive in deeper what would be the best way for them to reach out and connect with you?

Bruce Rosenthal 48:20
Great well name again is Bruce Rosenthal, and I’m on LinkedIn and post there pretty regularly a couple times a week with sponsorships success ideas, and my website is BruceRosenthal.associates. br uc EROSE, e n t h a l dot Associates, and there’s some white papers there some webinar recordings and then there’s a calendar with listing of upcoming webinars and speaking that I’ll be doing so a lot of resources for chambers.

Brandon Burton 48:51
Yeah, that’s great. We will get that in our show notes for this episode make it easy to find but, Bruce, this has been a blast having you on chamber tap podcast. I appreciate you setting aside some time and sharing some of your expertise and experience that you’ve learned throughout your career. As to corporate sponsorships. This has been a valuable episode and I appreciate your time.

Bruce Rosenthal 49:12
Right always planned to talk about sponsorship success.

Brandon Burton 49:16
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