Retention with Josh (JT) Torres & Isaac Lee

Below is an auto-generated transcription of my conversation with Josh (JT) Torres and Isaac Lee. Because this is auto-generated there are likely some grammatical errors but it is still a useful tool to search text within this podcast episode.

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Introduction

Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

Unknown Speaker 0:14
And now, your host, he always enjoys getting new pair of running shoes. Here’s my dad Brandon Burton.

Brandon Burton 0:21
Hello chamber champions. Welcome to chamber chat podcast. I’m your host Brandon Burton, and it’s my goal to introduce you to people and ideas to better help you serve your Chamber members and your community.

Our title sponsor is Holman Brothers Membership Sales Solutions. Let’s hear from Tony Felker, President and CEO of the Frisco Chamber to learn how the Holman Brothers have provided value for him.

Tony Felker 0:45
One of the key benefits that we’ve realized from Holman Brothers it’s actually happened many years after we started using them. We just completed our new strategic plan and understanding those subtle differences between transactional benefits and transformational benefits. The companies that knew what they expect has been a key part in our strategic plan. And we really want to thank Holman Brothers for that.

Brandon Burton 1:06
You can learn more about Holman Brothers Membership Sales Solutions by visiting holmanbros.com.

Guest Introduction

For today’s episode, we are we have two guests with us we have Josh Torres or j t as we’ll refer to him and Isaac Lee and in JT and Isaac are the co founders of chamber life. Josh is a seasoned entrepreneur with multiple businesses with multiple successful business ventures with a current focus and responsibility as co founder for the strategy sales, operation and alignment of the North America chamber life business. His style is innovative, creative and putting people first to benefit from the technology to ensure a better quality of productivity and success for chamber teams. He is enthusiastic, optimistic and future oriented individual with a high energy level, having a creative capacity to recognize and pursue opportunities naturally capable of setting up the internal systems procedures and processes necessary to operate a business with a focus on cash flow, sales and revenue at all times. Driven to be proactive in his approaches to everything with the vision to lead and inspire others. He has led chambers and associations for over 19 years and is married his wife Cindy and they have five children residing in Northwest Ohio. Isaac has a background in running chambers of commerce as well as economic development organizations. He has over 15 years of experience in these two industries. In addition to being a co founder of chamber life, Isaac is the executive director for stupid county EDC in the northeast corner of Indiana. Isaac has also served as a board member and consultant to the Chamber of Commerce executives of Ohio, where he has worked with hundreds of chambers and economic development organizations across the state of Ohio and Indiana, identifying the best practices as well as comprehensive policies to help move organizations forward in their communities. In 2012, Isaac was awarded the 20 under 40 award in the Toledo market in Ohio, and in 2013, Isaac was voted by his peers for the 2012 Professional of the Year Award through the Chamber of Commerce executives of Ohio. In 2019, Isaac was awarded the 40 under 40 Award by the Greater Fort Wayne Business Journal. In 2020. He was selected as one of the nation’s top 50 economic development professionals by consultant Connect. Isaac received his MBA from Defiance College and received his bachelor’s in marketing and human resources from the University of Toledo Isaac has been married his wife Kristin for almost 19 years and they have four children. But Isaac and JT I’m glad to have you with me today on chamber chat podcast. Why don’t you both take a moment to say hello to all the chamber champions listening and and share something interesting about yourself so we can get to know you a little better.

Josh (JT) Torres 4:12
Hey, chamber peeps, JT here. So excited to be on the show today. love working with all of you, in the state of Ohio and across the country. Super stoked to be here. One thing about me that I pride myself in I have a serious addiction with fitness and working out. And really every day regiment. So that’s something that I spend a lot about two hours in the morning doing before I start my day.

Brandon Burton 4:40
Very good. I should show you my my office space here. Doubles is my gym. So maybe afterwards. I’ll give you

Isaac Lee 4:48
a little time. And Brandon and guests thank you again for allowing us to take this opportunity to talk to folks. We’ve been in your shoes so we love speaking the chamberlain And we’re just talking about it. What’s what our best practices are? A unique thing about me, and I’m not too proud to say it right now. But I am a Notre Dame fan. And yes, I know we lost him. Wonderful last week. I’ve heard it all. But I’m a diehard Irish fan. So I’ll be hanging on.

Brandon Burton 5:17
It’s a rough start to the season, but you can’t be where you are without being a Notre Dame fan. Right? That’s true. Like I said, I’m glad to have you both with me today. As we dive in, usually, at this point, if I’m interviewing a chamber staff, or chamber executive, I haven’t talked a little bit about their chamber, but as cofounders of chamber life, tell us what is chamber life? What do you guys do? And as you service chambers of commerce, and just give everyone a bit little better idea of what chamber life is?

Isaac Lee 5:50
Absolutely. Josh, do you want to start it?

Josh (JT) Torres 5:52
Yeah, go ahead. I will. Absolutely. So you know, chamber life really takes two things that are most important to the business and chambers and I say business because we’re a business as a chamber organization, not a not a nonprofit, we were really want to run this as a business as chamber printers, as I like to call them. So you know, we came up with chamber life has a way to automate your task with recruitment and retention, that will do in dry, hopefully higher retention and conversion rates for your prospects that will ultimately lead to higher engagement, and making sure that all of your members are touched multiple times a year with with automated tasks that are assigned with our within our software. So we’re we’re excited about chamber life and the ability to take a pain in the market that’s been been there for many, many years, and automate that process for many.

Brandon Burton 6:42
Very good Isaac, do you have anything you’d like to add on, on what chamber life’s about?

Isaac Lee 6:47
I think it like several entrepreneurs, or founders of technologies or software. This was born out of frustration of Josh and I being in the industry and having the same struggles that many of your listeners are having, in terms of these packages, these platforms working for us, not just with us. And there was an opportunity to really automate some of these tasks that are very extremely important into our role of being a relationship based organization. So we often use the term it was built by you for you. When we talk about chamber life it because it’s truly sincere.

Brandon Burton 7:26
Very good. I appreciate that. That helps give a snapshot of what it is you guys do so and coming from from two guys that have experienced in chamber world and like you said, being built up built by you for you, because you are one of them. Thank you. So we’ve decided, as we go about this episode today to focus our discussion around that R word that JT had mentioned of retention. So we’ll be talking about membership retention, and maybe some approaches to take as when it comes to membership retention that maybe you haven’t tried before. Maybe it’s just maybe a different approach different perspective. But we’ll dive into that discussion as soon as we get back from this quick break.

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Alright, guys, we are back. As I mentioned before the break, we’re talking about membership retention, as we think of chambers out there the frustration like Isaac mentioned of how do you get these people to come back year after year see the value that they get for their membership. As you look at retention in membership, maybe JT what what comes to mind as as things that a chamber should maybe have a focus on or pay attention to when it comes to retention.

Topic-Retention

Josh (JT) Torres 11:33
So I think one of the things that you know, for many years we’ve focused on is the R word retention. But I really feel that moving ahead, you know, for the future of chambers, we need to focus on two things culture and the experience, there’s two things to culture that as chambers, we really need to make sure that we are focused on the internal culture, which is inside your boardroom, inside your inside your office walls, and then the external culture, outside your membership outside and your community culture is a big deal. And if we’re not managing and leading culture, that can really affect the our ability to retain, that culture can affect your brand, your brand, awareness, your promotion of your brand, and then really be able to tell the story of what are people saying about your organization. So culture is a big deal. The other thing is, by driving culture, we drive experience, what type of member experience are you having, at the after hours at the luncheon at the golf outing, even within your own board meetings with a new member orientation? Is that experience superior? That drives a culture of inclusivity welcoming and making sure that we’re always going to be there to take care of our members?

Brandon Burton 12:47
Like that. Isaac, do you have any thoughts as far as what a chamber should be thinking of when it comes to retention?

Isaac Lee 12:54
Yeah, and actually, it’s going back a little bit in our history to how a lot of our chambers were formed. It’s relationship based transactions, and I struggle saying the word transactions, but it truly is that think about the life of 200 members or an organization, a chamber the size of 200 members, that’s 200 relationships, and not all relationships are the same. So you really need to understand what each one of those relationships are looking for. Some are very needy want to be at all your events, some are just hey, I’m here for the benefits and everything else is a cherry on top, understand what that relationship is, and drive that home each and every year. Everything else that you try to do with that member to get them out of their space, might not achieve the same goal or return on investment in terms of your time your spending. So really understand what your members are, what they’re trying to do with the relationship that you have with them. And really concentrate on that.

Brandon Burton 13:54
Like that, if you’re saying relationships. And what I hear out of that is expectations. Like as you develop these relationships, you’re better understanding what the expectation is for each of these members. And oftentimes, if you’ve got a 200 member base, you’ve got probably close to 200 different expectations of what they’re looking for from you as a chamber. So without building those relationships and understanding what that expectation is, it makes it hard to create the culture and experience it’s a value to them, to keep them around for a long time and in for them to recognize the value they provide. As we circle back JT, I wanted to talk a little bit more about the culture. How do you decide what direction as a chamber? What direction do you go with creating culture and what your culture looks and feels like?

Josh (JT) Torres 14:49
So that’s a great question. So two things you really need to understand your membership and make sure that the is your board of directors set up to really good view Have what who your members are? Who sits on that board table? Is there a board matrix that represents as best as you can your total membership? That’s one thing. And the second thing is in the office, what type of training and professional development are we doing to help drive culture drive engagement, and make sure we have very much chamber execs that are excited to come to work, they know what they’re doing. They have the tools and the resources to be successful. And then that culture with in that office, you know, who was the best fit to drive membership retention, or do sales or do events, those types of things, many of our, our peers in the industry are solo chamber printers, they’re by themselves in the office full time or part time. And we have many out there that listen, that are volunteer run, that are trying someday to become revenue driven to the point where they can have a paid position. So really understanding Do we have the right fit? The right personas at the board representing the community? And then internally, do we have the right fit of individuals with the personas that can drive engagement and innovation inside the office?

Brandon Burton 16:07
So without being too abstract, I mean, is there a couple examples of culture like what comes to my mind it obviously every chamber is different. But just to throw some examples out there. If you create a culture of at our chamber, we show up and support new businesses with a ribbon cutting, or at our chamber, we do an annual, you know, luncheon for the first responders will say, we have a great respect in our community for first responders, and that becomes part of the culture. Is there some examples you can think of that, and I am hesitant, because I don’t want a chamber to listen and say, Oh, I have to do that. Right. It has to be catered for your community. But what would be some real examples of that being too abstract as to what culture could look like?

Josh (JT) Torres 17:02
So one, one example that we share in our association work and we’ve we still unfortunately have in our industry is the lack of welcoming at some that sometimes our luncheon or after hours, just by creatures of habit. And just in most instances by accident, when you have a new prospect that’s trying to join the chamber, or they’re a brand new member, and they come to an event, they don’t know anyone. And then they’re not maybe assign an ambassador or assign a board member to look after them with their on the registration list. That right there is a sense of how you can create an experience based upon the welcoming culture, they walk into a room and an after hours, two things happen, you know, they’ve got to be introduced. And then they’ve got to be able to follow through. So by driving engagement at those events, and making sure you’re inclusive and welcoming to that member, will give them a positive culture experience that will then hopefully drive more of that retention piece for them.

Brandon Burton 17:58
Isaac, do you have any thoughts that come up as far as what culture could look like some examples?

Isaac Lee 18:03
Yeah, so Josh is looking external to the organization, we just did a training last week internal to chambers of commerce, specifically for boards. And I’ll take that angle, we have a culture of your board, there’s usually three different expectations. At some core, there’s these expectations, it’s either the board members offering their time t talent is another T or treasurer. And we’re trying to teach that our staff and our board should understand what the culture is or what the nature is of that board member to have a good mix, it’s very difficult to have somebody who’s only there to offer their treasure, be the one to volunteer at all their events, meaning nations a treasure, but the ones that’s offering up their treasure, there may they may not offer up their time. That’s not what their skill set is. And we shouldn’t expect them to do otherwise, unless it also matches with what their motives are of the treasurer. So it’s the culture that we set within our board or organizations can also matter and have a deep impact on the success of our organization.

Brandon Burton 19:06
Like that. I like that response a lot. As we look at experience, creating a positive experience that helps you have that culture that is going to drive the experience. Isaac, may we start with you on this, you know, going down this path with creating that experience for members or bore me go either direction you want with that, but how do you go about creating that experience?

Isaac Lee 19:33
So one of the things that I recall for myself, when I was at the Defiance area Chamber, I had an experience where I was really paying attention to the relationship of my member and I found out that this local business of mine, there was a husband who was running the organization and assumed because of his title he was he was the go to. It wasn’t the case. Actually, it was a family owned business. And the wife did the books, but in a relationship Yep, it was unique in the sense that I was at an event. With them asking for sponsorships, I had been unsuccessful. But I listened to a conversation between these two individuals about this party that they were getting ready to have in the coming week. And the party was not about a family member was actually about a dog. very daring dog to this family. A couple of weeks later, I had seen the wife and the husband at another event, and something drew me upon the fact I should ask about how the party went. I did. This coincided with an ask of about $3,000, that up until that point, I asked about the dog, I was not successful. So when you think about, you know what it means to really drive home with a relationship, it wasn’t anything else that I offered at the Chamber of Commerce as an executive director, other than the willingness to care and ask about a family pet.

Brandon Burton 20:55
I like that that’s a, that’s huge, just being able to get on a relationship level with them, where I like to say you’re building a relationship of trust, you’re not just coming after them for money for the sponsorship, you’re showing the care and interest in them. So that definitely creates a better experience.

Isaac Lee 21:13
Now there’s follow up there to Brandon. Right. So after that, when I was there, guess who got a birthday card?

Brandon Burton 21:20
The dog? Yes. Awesome. So Jay, to me, from your perspective of creating experience.

Josh (JT) Torres 21:32
So no birthday cards to dogs? I’ll say that I haven’t had that in my tenure. But I really think what drives an incredible experience is when you identify the pain that a said business is having. And identify, again, that chamber provides, you know, chambers have fantastic where, with networking? Well, sometimes we need to up our ante and really understand what’s it What’s that business experiencing? You know, and how do we give them a feature not a benefit, let’s talk features, not benefits. Let’s talk about what feature the chamber we can provide to them to have the ultimate experience. And most quite honestly, if you can solve that pain with a game that may be networking that may be some of the great affinity programs that are out there that may be program and educational work that you provide to them. That may be work that you’re doing in advocacy, workforce development, talent, attraction DNI, whatever that pain is, if you have a game, which I’d like to call a feature, that definitely drives the experience, because then they realize, ah, someone is going to be able to help me. And somebody’s going to be able to guide me through navigating my challenge.

Brandon Burton 22:43
I love that I heard a quote A while ago, and I wish I could remember who it was. But it said something to the effect that if you can identify the pain for your customer, or will say your member better than they can describe it, that they’ll automatically assume that you have the answer that you have to solution. So if you can go about identifying what these pains are, then they’re going to come to you for the feature for the the gain for that benefit that you have to offer to them, and create a positive experience going forward. So I had a while back, I had read a book called you’re invited. And the whole book is about creating experiences for people were added, I can go down a deep rabbit hole with what the books all about. But one of the takeaways that I got from it and relating it to the chamber world is chambers are known for their networking events. Right? Right. And when you open up a networking event for any business, in your membership, people come they’re super uncomfortable, they might grab a drink, once they’re done, they’re out of there, you know, if they don’t have their buddy there that, you know, meet up with that networking can be super uncomfortable. But if you had a carefully curated mixer, say for example, for real estate, and you had title companies and you had banks and you had real estate agents, and they all have a common interest with each other, then all of a sudden, they have a reason to talk to each other, you know, the, the realtor may not have the need to talk to the vet when they don’t have a pet, you know, necessarily so it just creates some more, you know, natural experiences to build upon. And that really struck me as far as creating experience within a chamber is even just looking at it from the point of view of networking events that I’d like to have anybody I have on the show. Think of any any tips or action items as we we’ve got you both on and you both have great experience in the chamber world. So I see this as being like a bonus episode, a two for one. But what kind of tips or action items would you share for the chamber champion listening who wants to take their chamber up to the next level, Isaac, but we’ll go with you first.

Action Item/Tip for Chamber Champions

Isaac Lee 25:07
So I think one of the things Josh and I have been talking about and is at the core of chamber life. And what we do in terms of some of the automation is looking at the 90 days prior to an invoice as a great deal of opportunity. Far too often we catch them after they’ve started the invoicing and asking them for money, we need to really work on the relationship, 90 days prior to that invoice being created. That way when they get the invoice, the ability for that company to remember why you’re providing or what you’re providing and why it’s important. It’s a quick recall, it’s a quick payment, you’re not being judged against another invoice, especially for smaller businesses who might be on a shoestring budget, they’re going to recall it a lot quicker so that 90 days prior to an invoice is extremely important in a relationship.

Brandon Burton 25:59
I think that is so valuable. Have you seen metrics of you know, chambers that do implement the 90 days before versus ones that don’t? And what that retention rate looks like?

Isaac Lee 26:08
Yes, so chamber champions out there will probably relate to this, we’ve seen a pretty long, extensive accounts receivable report 90 plus days, right? Yeah, we’ve been able to show some pretty good track record records of reducing that by half, again, you’re still gonna have some folks that just don’t pay or corporations that just take longer 30 to 45 days, we understand that. But those that should be paying right on time, we’ve seen a drastic increase in how fast a chamber will receive its cash. Lauren is a GAO report and allowing us to spend more time elsewhere.

Brandon Burton 26:44
But what I like about that is when you’re building that relationship, or putting more attention into that relationship will say 90 days before the invoice is created, you’re doing the work to meet those expectations for that member before that time comes versus once the invoice is created. And then you’re trying to collect payment trying to see you know, resolve problems. And it’s a whole different skill set on how you approach and handle the the situation. So being able to stay more congruent with what your values are. And mission is as a chamber. That’s that is huge to have more focus on that that relationship 90 days prior. JT, how about you a tip or action item.

Josh (JT) Torres 27:29
So I call it the SW factor SW skilling will. So I think in the world today, we’ve got people that have the skill, and we got people that have the will, if they don’t have one or the other, what do we do to help them. So specifically with chamber staff and the teams that we work with across the state, and across the country with with some of the work we do, we’ve got brand new executives coming in to have the will, but we really want to make sure they have the skill. So it’s really near and dear to Isaac and I to make sure that we set up chambers for success, we just set up executives for success for career pathways for chamber, chamber management, and leadership, quite honestly. And then look at our boards of directors that continue to turn over there’s board burnout, no different than there’s executive burnout. And we find a lot of the times that we have board members that are willing to serve, but they don’t have the skill. They don’t understand what’s expected of them at that board of directors table, they don’t understand what’s expected of their skills, the skills that we can leverage of theirs, to really understand how to govern the Chamber of Commerce, and then you’ve got your members, they’ve got the will. But do they have the skills specifically to network? You know, I think chambers have a huge opportunity to do education attainment in networking. You know, we bring all these people to these events to network, some of are very uncomfortable. But then if networking is one of our number one spaces in some of in chambers, what are we doing to educate that member on how to specifically have the skill to to actually network understand the follow up afterwards, that drives more value for their experience?

Brandon Burton 28:57
I think that’s a valuable resource right there teaching how to network. Again, like I mentioned, can be super uncomfortable and and and it can be perceived you go to that experience. And it doesn’t go well as being a total waste of time. And what value does the chamber have for me, if that’s what their main selling proposition is? So being able to set them up for success, I think is huge. And goes right back to retention as well. So I like asking everyone I have on the show as we look to the future of chambers of commerce, how do you see the future chambers and their purpose going forward? JT, let’s we’ll go with you first this time.

Future of Chambers

Josh (JT) Torres 29:38
So I think the great business startup is happening and we see individuals that have had the skill for many years working for others start working for themselves. So I think entrepreneurialism and driving freelance and the gig economy I think is here to stay. I think chambers need to embrace and, and really empower entrepreneurship in their communities and be at the table with centers that provide that or find a way to quite honestly crowdfund a entrepreneurial community or create that ecosystem or be part of that ecosystem. I think that’s a big deal. Second to that I want and hope that chambers across North America, we, you know, again, we work in different parts of the country, even into Canada. And in the south Caribbean, there are there is absolutely an opportunity in the next five to 10 years and chambers for us to be driving global economy, just your chambers, having more of that virtual reality, the AI with chambers across the globe, having meetups with chambers in England, having meetups with chambers in Hawaii, Maine, chambers in Canada, and having live online networking opportunities that drive more of the global economy and get people really introduced to other parts of the world. I think chambers are positioned to do that fantastically.

Brandon Burton 30:57
I’m glad you touched on that the AI and the virtual experience, because we gained a little bit of that through COVID, learning how to use Zoom and do that sort of thing. But I think as we look to the future, for me, I actually am just releasing a blog post about this right now too. But as we look to the future, I like to look at, you know, the kids that are being raised right now, what are they into what’s their level of engagement, and they’re all playing these, you know, immersive, we would call them the video game, right? Whether it’s fortnight or Roblox or you know, any of these immersive type of games. And it’s not a start and a finish, like they’re living a life within this game. And they’re actually doing commerce within these games. So as a chamber of commerce looking to the future, they really should be looking at what that future generation is doing. And figure out how to get involved with that, you know, virtual commerce that’s that is going on, because it is very real. Isaac, what about you? How do you see the future and purpose of chambers,

Isaac Lee 32:05
I see the future that if you don’t change, you will become irrelevant. And what I mean by that is, most chambers have ran events the same way for a very long time. And there’s not anything wrong with that. But because of demographics, because of generational changes, and the things that the younger population are looking to get out of that relationship. Some of our older events have a tendency to fall by the wayside, declining revenues, declining attendance, they don’t offer the opportunity for them to be virtual, or engaged virtually pre and post the event. So really look at the things that you value within your organization, the events that you do, and find ways to introduce the opportunity to allow those to happen pre and post in a virtual environment, getting all populations involved, both young and old. From all of them different demographics and diversities to make sure that we’re preparing ourselves for what what comes ahead in terms of the way the population looks, it’s going to change, it’s changing now,

Brandon Burton 33:10
right underneath our nose, like that. And obviously, there’s a lot of events that chambers put on. But if you focus on maybe that big event that you do each year, or maybe it’s a couple of events, as you’re sharing that Isaac, I was thinking at ACC conferences here, they had the app people were engaging, you know, week leading up to it. And even a few days after the conference, you know, continuing to have those discussions and network virtually but then when you’re there in person, it was that much better. So great example I wanted to give you both an opportunity to share any contact information for people who’d like to reach out and connect with you and why don’t you share who would be the ideal type of chamber to work with chamber life and who could you best service

Connect with Isaac Lee & JT

Isaac Lee 33:59
Ooh, Josh, you want to go you want me to

Josh (JT) Torres 34:03
so I would say are the best benefit that we can provide for executives is a small to midsize chamber that is really our, our, our sweet spot. We provide a in addition to our automated productivity tool chamber life, we provide chamber moguls, which is a very much accelerated approach to leadership training, not management training for chambers. So we’re really in the business to take managers test and to make them leaders. So our software of course, does that one component piece where we automate the technology to give you more time to go out and build your business your chamber. So I think that that is definitely a our audience, our core audience.

Brandon Burton 34:51
Very good. Brandon, I add on that Isaac,

Isaac Lee 34:54
I was just gonna say I would add to it. In addition to the small and medium sized chambers, there’s really three things that we know our end users who excel in the system are doing, or have done in the past. If you write on post it notes and have them in your office, if you have a journal, and these are not all encompassing, by the way, if you have a journal and you use it actively, or if you have reminders in either Outlook or or Google or any other email services system, chamber life can help you with your organization.

Brandon Burton 35:26
So I think he just hit on everybody there between posted notes, journals, and the those reminders so. So contact information, what would be the best way for these especially small and midsize chambers to reach out and connect with you guys.

Josh (JT) Torres 35:42
So they can go to our website, YourChamberLife.com. And they’ll be able to get our information on there, they’ll be able to book a demo to either speak with us further about these types of opportunities, or take a test drive of our software.

Brandon Burton 36:01
Very good. I will get that in our show notes for this episode. So people can find that easily if they forget to add your to the beginning of that or whatever. So they can just go to the shownotes and find that. But Isaac, JT, I appreciate you guys taking some time to be with me today here on chamber chat podcast and and addressing an important issue of retention. I mean, that’s it’s kind of that stress that’s on top of every chambers. How do we keep these members that keep showing our value and relevancy? So, thank you for sharing your insight and experience with us and I’ve appreciate it.

Isaac Lee 36:38
Thank you, Brandon. We appreciate it. Tim.

Josh (JT) Torres 36:40
Thanks, everyone.

Brandon Burton 44:58
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