Category: Technology

How Forward-Thinking Initiatives are Reshaping Communities with Linda Parsons

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Brandon Burton (00:00.972)
Hello, Chamber Champions. Welcome to Chamber Chat podcast. I’m your host, Brandon Burton, and it’s my goal here on the podcast to introduce you to people and ideas to better help you serve your Chamber members and your community. Today’s guest is a seasoned leader in the Chamber and Association Management with more than 25 years of experience, advancing economic development and community collaboration. Linda Parsons has served as President and CEO of the Moore County Chamber of Commerce. since 2014. Under her leadership, the chamber has been nationally recognized as a four-star accreditation from the US Chamber of Commerce and twice named as a runner-up for the National Chamber of the Year. In 2025, Linda was honored by her peers as the North Carolina Chamber Executive of the Year, a testament to her impact across workforce development, business advocacy, and strategic planning.

Her leadership extends far beyond her role as she actively serves on a wide range of local and state boards focused on education, healthcare, childcare, and economic growth. Before relocating to North Carolina, Linda gained valuable public policy experience with the Ohio Chamber of Commerce and served under two Ohio governors as a state and local government commission. She holds a degree in politics and government from Ohio Wesleyan University and is a CCE and a graduate from the US Chambers Institute for Organization Management. Please welcome to the show Linda Parsons. Linda, I’m excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat podcast. I’d love to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the Chamber Champions who are out there listening and to share something interesting about yourself so you can all get to know you a little better.

Linda M. Parsons (01:50.836)
Well, Brandon, I really appreciate the opportunity to be here today. It’s always great to connect with our chamber colleagues across the country. So a little bit about myself. I think you asked for an interesting fact. And a lot of people do not recognize that I am artistically inclined. I was a ballerina until I was 18. And I am fluid in piano, violin, and a vocalist.

Brandon Burton (02:04.59)
That’s right.

Linda M. Parsons (02:19.341)
I am a painter and I have thrown pottery throughout the years. Currently not doing that, but so artistically, that’s always what’s motivated me and it’s what brings me joy when I have the time to do it.

Brandon Burton (02:34.7)
Yeah, I love that. And I wish we would talk more about that just as a society, just the joy that comes from creating things, know, just being expressing your creativity. There’s so much goodness that comes from that. So I’m glad you’re leaning into it. It is. It is. Yeah. Very good. I love getting those those little interesting facts about people.

Linda M. Parsons (02:49.299)
It’s also relaxing.

Brandon Burton (03:00.494)
If you would tell us about the Moore County Chamber just to give us an idea before we dive into our discussion today. Help us understand the size, staff, scope of work that you guys are involved with, budget, just to set the stage for our discussion.

Linda M. Parsons (03:14.291)
where I’d be happy to do that. So the Moore County Chamber of Commerce is located about an hour south of Raleigh in two hours from Charlotte, North Carolina. We are a population of about 110,000 people, one of the fastest growing counties in the state of North Carolina outside of an urban area with a projection to grow 50,000 people by 2050.

So it’s a lot of growth that is expected. I’ve also seen figures of another 70,000 residents. So we shall see. We are a tourism-based economy, and we also have a strong healthcare economy. We have currently 620 members with a staff of three, with just shy of a little over a half million dollar budget. And we are a mighty three.

Between the three of us, we have almost 40 years of experience in the chamber industry. All of us have a chamber background, which is extremely rare in the chamber industry. I’ve gotten both of them from seasoned chamber organizations, one in our state, one in the state of Texas. And we work very hard on a variety of issues ranging from workforce development, childcare is a very strong advocacy area, housing.

Brandon Burton (04:19.607)
Yes.

Linda M. Parsons (04:39.315)
transportation, leadership training. We have one of the oldest leadership training models in the state. And then of course, you know, just supporting that general member, whether it’s a solopreneur or a large corporation in our area. Golf is heavy. are home of the second home to the USGA. They built their second headquarters here in Moore County. And we also are home to the World Golf Hall of Fame.

And so if someone is a seasoned golfer, they’re probably very familiar with Pinehurst Resort, who is in the process of building another course in our community. So we have about 43 courses within 15 minutes of our community.

Brandon Burton (05:23.402)
Wow, well that is a great snapshot, but also painting a picture as you do, right, with your creativity, but painting a picture in the mind of what the community looks like. And I’m picturing with these beautiful golf courses and whatnot, just the beauty of the area as well. That definitely does help to set the stage for our discussion today. And as we kind of went back and forth a little bit on trying to figure out exactly what we wanted to cover,

Linda M. Parsons (05:24.263)
I’m out.

Linda M. Parsons (05:34.298)
Okay.

Brandon Burton (05:52.943)
I see a lot of the things that you guys are doing there in the Moore County Chamber as being very future forward, leaning and thinking. So we’ll dive into some of that future thinking, as well as some of the more actionable things that you guys have been doing to really take action on those thoughts and vision of what the future looks like. And we’ll dive into that as soon as we get back from this quick break.

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All right, Linda, we’re back.

As I mentioned before the break, today we’re talking about some of these future looking things that you guys are doing there at the Moore County Chamber of Commerce. One of the first things that I wanted to learn more about is I know you guys recently have gone about this, a new co-working space in your community and really targeting those people that work from home or those entrepreneurs and.

individuals like that, businesses like that. So please tell us a little bit more about the co-working space, how that came to be, how it works. know different chambers have co-working spaces, they’ve stood up, they all have their own nuances. So I’d love to hear the approach that you guys have taken and hopefully others listening will learn some things and be able to take some notes as to what they might do in their community as well.

Linda M. Parsons (07:12.209)
I’d be happy to do that. And I think one of the things that’s been very fortunate about our chambers, we have a board that has had progressive thinking throughout the years. They understood that if we remained the same, we would no longer be relevant in our community and for our region. We do serve a six county region, meaning we have a lot of traffic that comes into work and a lot of traffic that comes out. And we are also 45 minutes away from the largest military installation outside of the Pentagon.

So back in 2014, literally 30 days after I was hired, our building sold. It had been on the market for quite some time and I was working at the chamber at the time, but it wasn’t CEO. And so we sold our building and went to a temporary home and really tried to develop what our vision was. And we had heard about a particular business in downtown Southern Pines that was going to be building a building, three story building in the historic district.

So I approached him and asked if we could go into the building with him together and take the top floor. Fast forward to 2020, we built a building during the pandemic. We started that building in 2019 and finished it in 2020. There was some delays with supplies, but he was very forward thinking as the owner of the building, majority owner of the building where he had a lot of supplies dropped in before the final roof was put on. So a lot of the people that were having delays,

We didn’t necessarily have some of those delays. We did with appliances. But we went from a 10,000 square foot building that was built in the late 80s and was able to take that investment and turn it around into a 3,500 square foot penthouse suite in the downtown historic district of Southern Pines.

Brandon Burton (08:41.741)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (09:05.18)
It was probably one of the best decisions we’ve ever made. I literally threw the spaghetti on the wall and said, I think this is what we need to do. And when we do it, we need to open a collaborative workspace. Obviously not realizing that the entire world was going to shut down in March of 2020. So at that time, this construction had already started and I didn’t have the ability to shift the layout, but we moved forward and kept got creative. So we have a platform where people can drop in and work on a daily basis.

with a drop in rate. have subscriptions very similar to some of the corporations you see across the country, such as WeWorks, where they can pay to play a couple of days a week and a month. And then we have a conference room space that serves as overflow for individuals working quietly, not on Zoom calls or other things like that nature. And we have that ability to rent out that space.

One of the most popular things for us has been that remote worker who works for Fortune 500 companies across our country and they regularly use our space, they consider it their home. It does help where above a bar, but we also serve in adult environment if they so choose, as well as other snacks and coffee. I never thought an espresso machine would be so popular as it is. But one of our biggest leaders really has become the military

Brandon Burton (10:19.234)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (10:29.806)
Bye!

Linda M. Parsons (10:33.78)
component. So we have a lot of groups from the military that use that space sometimes for transitioning veterans to learn what they need to be doing to acclimate into the civilian world, as well as other training opportunities that they do in our space. And so I would say that is the majority of our user with the second being our members. And based on their membership, they have that option to use the space. So we have a lot of people that do team meetings, interviews.

Um, if someone is opening a new place in town, they have that opportunity to do other interviews if their growth is still under construction. It has been a revenue generator. So we were able to eliminate the God, the events that were a burden. Shall we say a time sucker for the stack. And now we just have to manage a calendar, which is fairly simple because we kind of have a regular users.

Brandon Burton (11:19.202)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (11:29.628)
And from there, it’s got a website, it’s got a following, and we are regularly booked. And it’s been a great investment for the organization and for our community.

Brandon Burton (11:43.437)
Yeah, I love that. love the, again, the forward thinking of being able to have that kind of space and before, you know, COVID even hit and to be able to see where needs are going and to be able to address that before they even really showed up in mass numbers like they did after the pandemic. I think there’s a uniqueness too of being able to serve

So you mentioned the remote workers, also entrepreneurs and startups and kind of that vibe that comes into it because they’re getting associated with the chamber early on in their journey. But I’ve also, I’ve seen and heard of some coworking spaces that are not connected with the chamber as being almost a chamber in themselves as far as the networking aspects go.

and who you meet within that networking space. Do you have any additional thoughts or insights on those points with the entrepreneurs and startups and the networking effect that happens in the coworking space?

Linda M. Parsons (12:52.752)
It absolutely is true. It is an opportunity for people that are working there to connect with others that may not have in otherwise while sitting in their living room navigating their children or their barking dog. And so I’ve actually seen some relationships form where they have now gotten into business together. Meaning we have a couple of consultants who have been able to do some work with some of our other workers.

During the holidays when everybody kind of took a break, it was fun to see everybody come back in January. How was your holiday? What are you working on? And we actually have one gentleman who used our space transitioning in his career, not military, but just a career transition. He got his MBA while in the space, was able to connect with one of those military groups and has now opened a consultant business.

So it’s fun to see those success stories, as well as the members who use the space as they grow and upsize their business and utilize it for team meetings and see that growth of those businesses or nonprofits that are using this space.

Brandon Burton (14:04.6)
Yeah, I love those success stories. What’s the relationship like with the work, with the chamber itself, kind of the space that you guys have within this top floor versus a co-working space? it kind of blend into each other? Is there distinct areas for chamber and co-working space or what does that lay out?

Linda M. Parsons (14:25.202)
It’s a complete blend. So we went with an urban design, meaning open ceilings, lots of metal. We did not shy away from comfortable furniture. We have standing desks. I’ll be honest, my board gave us complete discretion. They said, here’s your budget. You make it work.

And so we have an office in the front that is a collab space with a desk, a desk and a standing desk and a round table so people can have meetings. Then our offices are with incorporated within the middle. And then there’s another office in the back that gives a little more privacy. Again, conceivable, fix people. And then the conference room space is off of a massive kitchen and what we call the gathering space. So.

Great example on Friday mornings from seven in the morning until nine a.m. We have a group of military veterans that move our space for coffee. And when we come in at nine, they’re wrapping up, they clean up our kitchen, they go about their day. They’ve had their time to have a private coffee and we’re able to jump in through our workspace and do what we need. I do have a standing nine a.m. meeting every Friday. They know that. And even if they stay behind, they respect the fact that we are in our space.

working and doing our thing, but it gives a good blend. So our collab users have key fobs. can come and go as they please. And if we’re not there, they have access to the space, they have access to the kitchen and it works really well. So it’s a good blend. and it, it makes it feel like home. I don’t know how it’s. In fact, one of our coworkers users use that term this week.

Brandon Burton (15:48.93)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (16:08.77)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (16:13.875)
It’s a place that I call home.

Brandon Burton (16:17.132)
Yeah, that’s nice. That’s very nice. So I’m curious with the design and building it out, just from the little things from the scheduling to the key fobs to having the kitchen stocked. And did you guys consult with somebody else who’s done this before or was dreamed up on your own amongst the staff and the board and you guys like, let’s go do this. How did things come together?

Linda M. Parsons (16:44.479)
So when we initially came up with the concept and got the board approval, A, to move forward with the building and B, to do the collaborative workspace, we did visit several co-working spaces in our state. Most of them were corporate or other forms of, they weren’t connected to a chamber. And so we took some of those ideas, particularly knowing we were gonna be above a bar.

You know, we even discussed putting taps all the way from the first floor to the third, but we felt that we wouldn’t be able to go through a keg fast enough. So then we created relationships with local breweries. And so those breweries were able to put in the beer, can beer, so that the shelf life was a little bit better. We looked at those spaces from, you know, aesthetics, furniture, comfort.

Brandon Burton (17:17.219)
Right.

Linda M. Parsons (17:32.47)
And those things were very important to us. Standing desks are extremely important, but not everybody likes the standing desk. Some people like the sit. Some people like high tops, so we have high top tables. And then we very thoughtfully configured our conference room. If anybody remembers their science days from high school, you had a black top science lab table with wood legs. We reversed it. have

Brandon Burton (17:52.877)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (17:58.368)
custom-made tables made in the state of North Carolina out of ash wood with black metal legs all on casters. So the room can be configured in whatever format somebody wants. Whether it’s a large conference table, they want to do classroom seating for a training session, which obviously works really well for the chamber when we hold a session. I’ve seen it done in pods where people are working with individual teams.

Brandon Burton (18:09.368)
Very cool.

Brandon Burton (18:17.944)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (18:25.225)
And that has been very good. And then the other thing is we went with very top of the line technology. We did not shy away from technology. I talked to our IT guy and I said, I want you to bring in the best IT that you can possibly bring in. If the chamber is encouraging businesses to be on the top of their game as it relates to marketing, IT and other things, we can’t not do the same. So we have a seven-point television.

that does direct streaming. have access so that they can do Zoom meetings or other video type teleconferencing. We have mics around the room. We have a second TV in the room, because it’s kind of an L shape. So you can have a private session in the other part of the app. We have the same technology in the other offices. And we’re not shying away from updating it. With some of our military folks, we have some more restrictions.

Brandon Burton (19:12.622)
Okay.

Linda M. Parsons (19:25.211)
in reference to how they access technology. We’ve been working with them as well so that they can still access due to their firewalls and be able to utilize the space. So we didn’t shy away from the technology. And when we had our full budget, that was something that we thought, Philippe, thought about. Plus we have TVs in the lobby. So if they need to stream something while they’re in the kitchen using space or highlight a sponsor.

whatever their program is, they can do this thing. As it relates to the key fobs, it’s part of our security system. Probably the biggest challenge is if we lose internet and power. That’s a problem. But we can work around it and we have, but technology’s great, but you can’t control mother nature. And a couple of years ago, unfortunately, Moore County was

Brandon Burton (20:07.342)
Ugh.

Linda M. Parsons (20:24.277)
had a massive power outage that was done by a human, not by Mother Nature. And so we could not access our space because the town with the county was out of power for seven days. I was the only one with a computer, but all of our collab users completely understood because they couldn’t work either.

Brandon Burton (20:38.328)
Move.

Brandon Burton (20:45.39)
Brave.

Linda M. Parsons (20:46.005)
We didn’t make the national news and it’s unfortunate that someone chose to do that to our entire power grid. But those were good lessons to learn. How do we overcome that? We put in some other parameters so that we can get into our space, but sometimes you just can’t control technology. So it’s great, but Mother Nature or unfortunately some people have other plans and you just have to work around them. And we’ve got great people. They’re like, understand it.

Brandon Burton (20:56.27)
Thank

Brandon Burton (21:05.059)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (21:15.778)
Yeah. So there’s been a few different times and ways you’ve mentioned the forward thinking of the board and of your staff. It sounds like historically, at least in recent years, there’s been a very forward thinking board for your chamber. What are some, a few other examples maybe of looking to the future and planning ahead and not getting caught, you know, with the

unexpected with what the future presents.

Linda M. Parsons (21:47.328)
think I’ve been very fortunate in my tenure as president to have a board that understands that the three of us do have chamber experience and we look thoughtfully at studies, whether it’s ACCE studies, whether it’s our own studies that we’re doing and monitoring our membership trends, things of that nature. And so we bring things to the board and we make our recommendations on not what’s happening today. You’re always gonna have your

these events are happening or this program is occurring, we are always moving five years ahead. So a great example back in 2014, I actually made my board read the book, The End of Membership as you know it. And I’ve used a lot of those books and guides to help them understand that if we continue to, I used to use the term be our grandfather’s chamber, maybe to some it’s a

great grandfather. Not that they didn’t do wonderful things, but we wouldn’t remain relevant in our community. There’s a lot more competition. There’s a lot more ability to do things digitally. There’s just a lot of competition. And so by being able to stand out as a organization who’s been around for 59 years, I think always looking ahead, how can we do something differently? So we eliminated a majority of our events and we really focused on some key

leadership, HR training that’s connected to workforce development, childcare, housing study. So we’re investing in a different wave, the long-term of our community and our employers in our area, whether they’re a nonprofit, a small business, a large business. And it’s been really good. I think that members, we still do networking. You’re always gonna have a little bit of networking.

It’s a critical piece, but sometimes you can remind them you can network differently. You can network digitally, even through our own organization. You can connect with a military person and help them as they develop their resume and transition into the civilian life. And so it’s really been, we’ve been really fortunate to have that board who really hasn’t stopped us from trying something. Have we had failures?

Linda M. Parsons (24:13.233)
Absolutely. And I think those failures too.

Brandon Burton (24:15.726)
I’d hope so. Otherwise, that means you’re not taking any risk, right?

Linda M. Parsons (24:18.641)
Exactly. And I love to take risk, calculated risk. The building was probably one of my biggest calculated risks. That’s a pretty big risk. But I know that if it is a beautiful building, it is set in a beautiful place. And a lot of people think it’s an historic building. To me, that is a win.

Brandon Burton (24:24.195)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (24:30.318)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (24:44.514)
Yeah, that is really cool.

Linda M. Parsons (24:46.037)
I had someone recently come in, they’re like, so how old is this building? And I’m like, five years?

Brandon Burton (24:51.47)
But with the spirit of 100, right?

Linda M. Parsons (24:56.731)
Exactly. I think, you know, analyzing what programs are successful in a chamber. What does the chamber industry look like in five, 10 years? What are trends that we’re seeing? For example, AI, know AI is an important trend. So we’re in process of developing a curriculum in partnership with our local community college to help our business community navigate AI to their benefit and learn it so that

they’re doing things safely and that they’re doing things that are going to be helpful to their business as they continue to right size their business. we’ve held a session last fall. We sold out in seven days and we did it in our our own respective conference room and we’ve had a request to have it again. And so it’s it’s been great to see that excitement and the people that were in that room for that program are

were not traditionally attending events. And so I think you have to, you can’t just do one size fits all. Our chamber is not a one size fits all. We like to…

Brandon Burton (25:57.708)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (26:08.437)
cater things to the members’ needs, whether they’re small, medium, or large.

Brandon Burton (26:15.918)
I love that. So as you’re giving that response, my mind’s racing with all these different things, but like you’d mentioned, networking is always going to be some aspect of the chamber and paying attention to tools that are coming. I recently did an episode with the founder of an app called Chamber, but with a Y, so the C-H-A-Y-M-B-E-R. And it’s all about being able to network digitally or you meet somebody in person, but then you connect digitally and

continue to build that relationship and that networking. And there’s great tools and resources available that we just need to be aware. And like you mentioned, AI and being able to stay on the forefront of some of these things and introduce them to your membership and help them gain the confidence to use some of these new tools because change can be scary, right? I mean,

just human nature, like if you wanted to survive, you don’t change, right? So being able to help hold their hand through some of this change is so important. But being from Ohio, you may be familiar with Matt Appenzeller, Southern Ohio Chamber Alliance, but he’s made the distinction between with chambers being either a lamppost, where you’re shining a little bit of light on a

portion of town square or being a lighthouse where you’re really showing, you’re shining the light of where the direction needs to go. Really, you know, bringing people along to where you see things are going and guiding them that way. And that’s, that’s what I see you guys doing there at the Moore County Chambers, being more of a lighthouse and really shining that light, saying this is where things are going, come along with us because this is where the future is bright.

Linda M. Parsons (28:03.125)
We talked a little bit about in the beginning about my artistic background. I’ve always said that sometimes a chamber is kind of like a conductor, a conductor of a symphony. We may not always have the answer, but we can connect and collaborate with different organizations or people to help make our businesses and our local economies be successful. I may not always have that answer, but I can connect a business to our local school system. I can connect them to the college.

Brandon Burton (28:11.011)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (28:30.447)
When everybody was saying, what are we going to do? Everybody’s leaving the workplace. I need employees. I need more students to go into this career path. OK, well, let’s start a workforce development collaborative task force so that we can work in partnership instead of all working in silos. A lot of times, that’s what happens in communities. Everybody’s working on something, but they’re not talking to each other. OK, well, it’s not going to be successful if you’re not talking to each other, being direct and open. And events will always have their place.

Training will always have its place, but our world is changing and we’ve got to change with it to continue to remain relevant to our members, otherwise known as investors, who are investing in us and our community.

Brandon Burton (29:17.08)
That’s right. I love that. Well, Linda, as we begin to wrap things up, I wanted to ask on behalf of the listener who is striving to take their organization up to the next level, what kind of tip or action item might you share with them as they strive to accomplish that goal?

Linda M. Parsons (29:34.804)
I do think reading the book, End of Membership as you know it, is a really good idea. And I really think taking a pause and stepping back and doing an analysis of everything that you’re doing, what is successful, how much time are you putting into it. The people time does cost you money. And if you’re doing an event to turn around to do in another event to pay for that event, is that really the most cost effective thing?

Brandon Burton (29:54.99)
We are finished.

Linda M. Parsons (30:02.101)
for your organization and the members that you serve. Sometimes taking that pause is scary, but by doing an analysis of everything that you’re doing, helps you move forward. While we did that back in 2017, we actually had a discussion yesterday that we’re gonna be doing it as a team discussion again, so that we’re prepared for this next 10 years. And…

and are able to continue to serve that investor of our community. So I do think that’s important. I also think if you’re really new in the career, find a mentor, find somebody that you, an organization and a person that you can regularly check in with. Being at the top is lonely. It’s a lonely place to be and one of the most exciting places to be, but it can be scary. Taking those risks are scary at times. And so being able to talk

Brandon Burton (30:53.539)
Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (30:57.599)
through those things with somebody I think is important.

Brandon Burton (31:01.324)
Yeah, absolutely. And really the idea of looking 10 years in the future and trying to plan and work towards that before too long, you have a 10 year plan, but you probably have to readdress it on an annual basis and see, we still on track? And I had heard a recent interview of Elon Musk and somebody was asking him about how he sees the future. And this is the man who’s literally building the future, right? With self-driving cars and robots and

Linda M. Parsons (31:28.341)
Correct.

Brandon Burton (31:31.286)
putting people on Mars. And he gave a great forecast of in the next one to three years, but himself, he said, 10 years? I have no idea. I have no idea what the future looks like in 10 years. And I think it’s good to have a plan, but we need to constantly make sure we’re still on course with that plan, that we’re going in the right direction.

Linda M. Parsons (31:51.638)
Absolutely, because you never know what curve ball such as COVID, which a lot of people got thrown at, know, nobody knew that was coming and you had to pivot and you have to be able to pivot quickly.

Brandon Burton (32:00.751)
Yeah, exactly. Well, Linda, I feel like this whole episode we’ve been talking about the future of chambers, but I’m going to ask the formal question that I always ask towards the end of an episode, which is how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?

Linda M. Parsons (32:21.449)
think we are at a great place to really excel our communities forward. Kind of looking at that road where you have two choices to go, Chambers had the opportunity to really pull their communities and help them in the areas of workforce development and bring employees to their employers, whether it is cultivating that relationship as young as kindergarten.

to others who are maybe second chance individuals looking for employment, veterans, the opportunity is there. And I think the chambers that embrace that and start working as collaborative units in their communities are gonna excel and be extremely successful.

Brandon Burton (33:09.526)
Yeah, I love that. And that visual again, that road, I think Alice in Wonderland, right? She comes to the fork in the road and she asks, which way do I go? Right? And the Cheshire Cat says, it depends on where you want to go. You know, and you got to know where you’re headed. Yeah.

Linda M. Parsons (33:15.658)
Mm-hmm.

Linda M. Parsons (33:20.277)
She does.

And every community is unique. Every community has its place. Every community isn’t the same. And yes, we borrow things from communities, but you have to look at your own community and what does that future hold?

Brandon Burton (33:38.004)
Exactly. Well, this has been a fun discussion. I’m grateful to have had you on the show. I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for listeners who may want to reach out and connect with you and learn more maybe about the co-working space or how you guys are navigating the future. What would be the best way for someone to reach out and connect?

Linda M. Parsons (33:58.176)
So they can contact me directly at the chamber, 910-692-3926. If they want to see a little bit about our space, they can visit thirdfloorcollabspace.com. And if they want to visit a little and learn a little more about the chamber, it’s moorecountychamber.com. We do get confused with Moore, Oklahoma. In fact, today we have an application for a membership in Moore, Oklahoma.

Brandon Burton (34:15.371)
you

Linda M. Parsons (34:24.937)
We are not in Moore, Oklahoma. We are in North Carolina. So please be mindful of that. You can find me on LinkedIn as well, as well as LinkedIn.

Brandon Burton (34:32.334)
Very good. I’ll make sure to get those in the show notes and make it easy for people to find and connect with you. But Linda, thank you so much for spending time with us today here on Chamber Chat Podcast sharing your experience and some of these things that you guys are doing to really position your community well for the future and look after those investors that are within your stewardship. I really appreciate you sharing those things with us.

Linda M. Parsons (35:00.106)
Thank you, Brandon, for the opportunity and I wish the Chamber community all the best.

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Chamber Tech Innovations with Christopher Patton

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Brandon Burton (00:00.876)
Hello, Chamber Champions. Welcome to Chamber Chat podcast. I’m your host, Brandon Burton, and it’s my goal here on the podcast to introduce you to people and ideas to better help you serve your Chamber members and your community. Joining us today is a tech industry veteran turned chamber innovator, Chris Patton. With over a decade of executive experience in the tech world, Chris has scaled companies through major growth and multiple mergers and acquisitions.

But it was opening a kid strong franchise and joining his local chamber that sparked a whole new passion, which is transforming the way chambers connect with their members. saw firsthand how chambers were lacking modern user friendly tech that delivered real value to their members. That insight led him to found Chaymber, that’s C-H-A-Y-M-B-E-R, a company dedicated to building an elegant, intuitive app that helps chambers

It helps chamber members do what they came to do, network, build relationships and grow their businesses without the clunky watered down CRM experience. Now laser focused on innovation in the chamber space. Chris is on a mission to make member engagement seamless, effective, and actually enjoyable. Chris, I’m excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat podcast. I’d love to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the chamber champions who are out there listening. And if you would.

share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you little better.

Christopher Patton (01:30.394)
Yeah, I’m grateful for the opportunity. I was glad we got to connect recently and learn more about each other. You know, being somebody newer to the chamber industry, right? It’s always nice to have new connections. That’s what it’s all about. As far as something interesting, you know, it’s always subjective, right? I’d say the most exciting thing in my life right now is that I have what will soon be an eight month old daughter, Juniper.

So as you can imagine, she is really the focus and highlight of everything I’ve got going on.

Brandon Burton (02:03.693)
What a fun stage too. Just starting to wake up and experience the world. So that’s very cool.

Christopher Patton (02:09.572)
waking up, waking up at all hours, for sure. Yeah.

Brandon Burton (02:12.353)
That’s right. Just waking up in general. Very good. Well, usually at this point, I have the guest tell about their chamber or their organization just to kind of give a little background and kind of set the stage for a conversation today. So maybe just take us through high level what chamber is all about, what it is, and then we’ll dive into the details a little bit later.

Christopher Patton (02:36.484)
Yeah, yeah. So we do two main things. We provide Chambers of Commerce, a new medium to be able to interact and engage with their members through this mobile branded experience with push notifications and more. And then we provide their members a tool to actually be able to engage and network with each other. So those are the two main things. We certainly have a whole bunch more features within the application and system and a whole lot more in our roadmap coming.

But you know, I always like to say that, you know, this is a platform that’s built by a chamber member for chamber members, right? So really trying to take that member experience that I know so well and my technology background and connecting the two.

Brandon Burton (03:21.291)
Yeah, now that’s great. I love it when somebody comes into it from the perspective of seeing the issue themself and then creating the solution to the problem that they’ve seen. So it tends to add a lot more value and insight to the product as it comes out. Well, today we’re gonna dive in on a topic of how chambers tend to facilitate through using their CRM to connect with members to.

just manage the organization at large, the reasons why people join Chambers to begin with, and seeing how Chamber, your app, can be a solution to some of these issues and struggles that we see on a regular basis. So we’ll dive into that as soon as we get back from this quick break.

All right, Chris, we’re back. So as I mentioned before the break, we’re talking today about how Chambers tend to rely maybe a little too heavily on their CRM to manage the organization. And don’t get me wrong, CRMs are great. I don’t know how chambers would function without them. But share with us from your perspective, what do you mean when you see chambers relying too heavily on CRMs?

Christopher Patton (04:28.476)
So.

Christopher Patton (04:36.006)
Sure, I think what I’ve learned, well, maybe I’ll share this tidbit. Every single sales demo call I do, feels like it turns into this therapy session about their CRM, right? And I appreciate that we’ve established that good of a relationship, kind of from the get go with lot of these folks, but it’s…

It’s a necessary evil for lack of a choice. I use a CRM for my business. It’s part of how we do business nowadays. sometimes they kind of get sold the bill of goods as far as like it’s the panacea that will do everything for them. And what I’ve come to learn being in the tech industry for a while is if you have a tech product that’s trying to do everything for everyone, they’re delivering to no one.

Brandon Burton (05:07.063)
Sure.

Christopher Patton (05:28.636)
because there’s really a lack of product vision. And I feel like that’s what we have, Is really focused product vision. So when I talk to these shamers about their CRM doing everything, right? Whether it’s the events, the billing, the emails, right? A lot of the times they’ve got all these things in the systems, but they are just super clunky. They’re not intuitive for them to use.

It scares them off more than anything, to where it’s possible that their CRM does some things that maybe we do, but it is so tough for them to navigate that they start looking elsewhere. With that being said, I know we’ve got features that their CRM does not do for sure, but I think that’s how I’d explain it is they’re under the impression the CRM will do everything for them, but it’s almost like information overload and

It’s really tough to navigate. It makes it hard.

Brandon Burton (06:30.894)
And I think, you know, bottom line is that a CRM can be great when, when it does do what you want it to do, when you can plug in with the calendar and you can, you know, have everything recorded in a CRM. There’s a ton of value to be able to go back to that and see what are all the touch points with their customers, with our chamber members. But the reality is when it becomes too difficult to use and they don’t use it and they start looking for other solutions that maybe don’t communicate with their CRM, that

end up being its own clunky system in its own by trying to kind of patchwork different things together. So having somebody like you who’s bringing something from the perspective, as we’ve talked about, where you’ve seen where these struggles, where these disconnects are, and with their tech background, to be able to find a solution that actually works. I think there’s so much value to that. Yeah.

Christopher Patton (07:27.554)
Ditto.

Brandon Burton (07:29.814)
I love the therapy session too, about CRMs. Because there’s so much good in them, but it’s like some of these things get added in almost as an afterthought of, yeah, we can do that too, but it’s not being done really well. It’s just in there because they can. But being able to maximize how these different tools work together is where you really get the key impact.

Christopher Patton (07:51.686)
Yeah. Hey, could I share another anecdote about the therapy session real quick? So I use AI note taker for all my calls so long as the person’s okay with me using it, which is pretty normal to have on our calls nowadays. And I always take my transcripts and I think you and I talked a little bit about this where I’ve got my AI business advisor, right? And I upload my transcripts for what I did for the day as well as everything else.

Brandon Burton (07:56.077)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (08:14.062)
Yep.

Christopher Patton (08:18.344)
A tool I’d recommend for everyone is create your own AI board of directors or some version of that. My business advisor at this point, man, they get it. like, this CRM is really causing these people, it’s happened again. Even my AI business advisor knows and they get it now.

Brandon Burton (08:35.073)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (08:39.426)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We did talk about that. Having that, that AI board of directors and, and we’re not talking about, you know, the board of directors of the chamber, but people that you value their input, their insights where you can take issues and, and really just have their, virtual essence, you know, give you some positive feedback and help guide you. So great, great advice. so Chris, I know you’ve looked into the reasons why people join a chamber, why businesses join the chamber.

Christopher Patton (08:49.222)
Correct.

Brandon Burton (09:09.27)
to begin with. mean, you’re a business owner with Kid Strong. What did you join the chamber for with Kid Strong?

Christopher Patton (09:17.572)
Yeah, the real first reason was ribbon cutting, right? That was such a special moment for me to open the doors to my business, right, in my community. So, you know, naturally I was like, okay, this is how we do like the formal ribbon cutting, right, is with my local chamber. And it’s that day one high of when you’re with your Chamber of Commerce. And I love my local chamber here in my community. They do such amazing things.

But it was impossible for me as a business owner and being somebody on the tech side to not start connecting the dots after that. But then I’d say the other two main reasons is the same reasons, the data shows the top two reasons are because people want to network with fellow business leaders and they want to get more exposure for their business. And that was really my thesis behind Chamber and the direction I went in when we started building it out.

That was my motivating factor for joining and eventually building our product too.

Brandon Burton (10:15.475)
Yeah, so talk to us more about chamber. How does it help solve some of these issues of why, I mean it’s not doing ribbon cuttings for chambers, but how is it addressing some of these other things that people are joining the chamber for?

Christopher Patton (10:31.868)
Yeah, I need to go talk to my AI advisor to figure out how can we do ribbon cutting for Chambers. Now, yeah, so it serves, again, there’s two main purposes, which is giving Chambers of Commerce the new medium to be able to communicate with their members. And then, and I’ll jump into some more detail, and then there’s the member-to-member interaction side of things. So, what I will say is, there are even some CRMs that have an app that you can get. And…

Brandon Burton (10:35.638)
Right?

Brandon Burton (10:54.67)
Thank

Christopher Patton (10:58.972)
You know, I’d ask those chambers when they think of when they bring that up is how’s the adoption in those apps? And is it because the concept of an app is not good or is it because the app is not good? Right? There’s plenty of apps that are really successful. So, you know, that’s again another one of my core beliefs is that just giving your members a portal to like update their billing information, you know, and things like that is not going to be this

this really motivating factor for them, right? So when we come back to the first item with the ability for chambers to be able to communicate to their members, right? You’ve got the events, you’ve got the news where they can do the push notifications to their members and even transactional emails to folks that haven’t downloaded the app yet.

Brandon Burton (11:39.992)
the facts we want to

Brandon Burton (11:50.03)
Thank

Christopher Patton (11:54.938)
And then we’ve got things like exclusive offers and business spotlights so they can highlight more of their businesses in a new way to their community. And then we also digitize their directory. So it’s pretty standard that most chambers of commerce have a list of all their businesses. And we’ve actually got an integration with Google Maps. So that way, we take all of their businesses and give them their own localized Google Maps within the app as well.

Brandon Burton (12:18.606)
Thanks

you.

Christopher Patton (12:22.596)
as well as like group chat functions. So can take your committees and give them their own group chats within the app. Plenty of other things. And then when it comes to the member to member interaction side of things, the real kind of real world use case I like to give is Brandon, let’s say we go to a networking event together. What typically happens is like we meet each other and the relationship probably ends there until we see each other at another event. And

What we’ve done is tried to change that, right? So if we meet at the event, we can connect in the app. And once we connect in the app, our system sends out a branded email for whatever Chamber of Commerce. So we own all the automations. So the Chamber of Commerce doesn’t have to worry about it. It actually connects us both through email. So then the next day when we get back to our office, wherever the eager beaver there is, can pick up the communication from there. And we can set up a business meeting. can…

just be connected for whenever we wanna connect again in the future. So it really takes those in-person connections and brings more value to them overall.

Brandon Burton (13:29.454)
Yeah. So the networking piece of it really is what captures my attention. That’s the big differentiator that I see is being able to take those in-person interactions that we’ll admit can be a little awkward sometimes, especially the follow-up can be a little awkward, bit salesy maybe, you know, depending on what it is. But when you can make a connection and really, you know, see that there’s something there, you know, mutually beneficial.

to connect on the app and then let that drive, you know, continued interaction down the road is so valuable.

Christopher Patton (14:04.028)
Yeah, because what happens, the real example I always give, and I always get smiles, and so it validates my thought here is, you give me a business card, I give you a business card, if we’re lucky, we remember to take it out of our pants before we do laundry. And know, best case scenario, it ends up in a pile in the corner of our desk, and you know, we like never get around to sending it. Yeah, don’t show whoever that is. But yeah, that pile.

Brandon Burton (14:25.48)
This pile. Right? Yeah.

Christopher Patton (14:31.836)
But that’s what I love, because now I go to my chamber events and I’m like, no, no, no, I’m not taking your business card. I’m going to connect with you in the app. then boom, we get an email into each other’s inboxes right there. And even if they haven’t downloaded the app yet, they get a notification through email saying, hey, Chris is trying to connect with you. And it prompts them to download the app. So we’ve tried to set up a lot of automations as well. When we think about why are other systems not being successful?

other apps not being successful. That’s a lot of it is you can’t just send an email at once telling your members to download something and assuming it’ll be successful. You got to really integrate it into your daily operations, but also you got to give them a tool that they actually want to use. That’s what it really comes down to.

Brandon Burton (15:17.398)
Yeah. Yeah. For me, seeing an unread email or an unread alert, you know, in an app is going to get my attention and bug me a lot more than seeing a stack of business cards on my desk that get buried by other papers. So I see where that, that really can propel, you know, those connections. so when you talked about the adoption of apps, just in general, like the CRM has an app. so it made me think I’ve been working with chamber since before iPhones came out.

Christopher Patton (15:27.836)
Yeah. That’s it.

Brandon Burton (15:47.457)
So not trying to date myself too much, it’s a, that where the iPhones, the androids came out and it was probably within two to three years, you start seeing the CRMs, the chamber CRM starting to launch apps because that was the new sexy thing is to have an app for your, iPhone or the Android. And it really was just super, super basic. And I really haven’t seen a whole lot of innovation going forward with those.

And I don’t know that the adoption was ever great in the beginning because it was essentially what you’d find on their website, just in an app. And if you don’t have to download an app to access the information, why would you? So anyway, I see where, where the adoption can be a challenge. Um, and for those who are, who are listening, who say, yeah, we have an app and nobody downloads it and nobody uses it or whatever. I think it all goes back to the value. Yeah. I believe it all goes back to the value. What’s the purpose of the app?

Christopher Patton (16:23.932)
Mm-hmm.

Christopher Patton (16:39.782)
Yeah, I believe you. I believe you.

Brandon Burton (16:46.798)
How’s that bettering to, working to better enhance the business environment, the interactions with individuals. So having something of value is very helpful and we’ll get that adoption going.

Christopher Patton (17:02.342)
Yeah, and if I could say real quick, whether it’s about CRMs or something else that the chambers use, a lot of technology they adopt is understandably so to help with their operations, right? So they can run their chamber more effectively. I totally understand that. And that’s where we are different. It’s like, we’re trying to cut through the noise and bring value in a different way, and we’re giving you a tool for your members. So no, we’re not your CRM. We’re another CRM.

And in some cases, are, yes, we are an added cost compared to what you’ve been paying. And that’s usually why they’re reaching out to me is they’re trying to see if they can find a cheaper CRM that still does a lot of the things, right? So, that budget conversations are real, but luckily I know we’re priced really competitively. But that’s where sometimes I think chambers get a little focused on

just having tools and tech for them and not the people they’re supposed to be servicing, the people that are paying the bills.

Brandon Burton (18:07.456)
Exactly. So talk to us about your app and how it works as far as like a chamber being onboarded. Is there data that’s provided to them as far as the user experience and feedback that maybe they can record some things in their CRM so they don’t totally lose, you know, that information? Because I do see a lot of value in that and who’s engaging and at what level.

Christopher Patton (18:32.026)
Yeah, great question. So, you know, all the members get pushed to download at the Chamber app. But as soon as they’re in the app, everything is white labeled and branded as whatever Chamber of Commerce. So they’re getting that experience, both in the logos and the coloring they’re seeing, as well as the push notifications that they’re seeing. And then, you know, as far as using this, the information they already have available. So the good thing is they’ve got this information in their CRM.

Truth be told, I talked to plenty of, I talked to.

they rely on spreadsheets as well. They don’t even have a CRM. so nonetheless, they just can simply upload their member information and that’s what provides access to the members. Same thing with the directories. When I talked about that Google Maps, right? They just download the list of their member businesses from their CRM or their source of truth spreadsheet. They just upload it into the backend admin system that they have access to. And that’s what…

dictates what businesses are listed in there, what businesses can get spotlighted. So we can pull all that industry data and descriptions from Google itself.

Brandon Burton (19:46.733)
Yeah. So I think it’s important for Chambers to be tech forward thinking. I mean, that’s the way everything is going, right? When you just said spreadsheet, it made me cringe because I know there’s a handful of Chambers out there that are still trying to do things by a spreadsheet. So I know you have some thoughts as far as the tech forward thinking and especially as it relates to Chambers.

Christopher Patton (20:14.458)
Yeah, yeah. You know, I’m lucky in that I’ve had the chance to work for some pretty great organizations in the tech side for a while. So being an outsider to the Chamber of Commerce niche has been a learning experience for me. But at the same time, it’s helping me kind of show some folks some opportunities. I met with somebody recently who is new to their sales job, and I was showing them some of the tech tools I use.

for my outreach and just the automations and they were like, this is really cool. I need to get this set up. And so always happy to talk to people about that. yeah, Chambers of Commerce, right? They serve such a pivotal role in all of our local communities and they’re representing all these businesses in their community. And then sometimes they’re probably, sometimes they’re the least.

tech savvy organizations, not the people. And sometimes it’s budget limitations, It’s not for lack of care or effort. I see that in my conversations. There’s definitely that desire to adopt new technology because as you mentioned earlier, some of the bigger players in the market, they’ve been around for a while in the chamber industry as far as technology products and there’s just a lack of innovation.

Is the most blunt way to put it and and they’re raising prices at the same time. I mean I hear that constantly And you know, that’s what happens when you have somebody that has a massive market share right or there or there’s fewer players in a marketplace But I view that as exciting because that means there’s an opportunity for disruption both with what we’re offering and and this is really like V1 of our product I’m I am so stoked about all the things we have in our roadmap and I

telling you guys like we’re building a CRM. Like it’s happening. And you know, with all the feedback that I’ve gotten, I’ve done a number of discovery sessions with different chambers of commerce. So naturally I want to make sure we build something that people love. I mean, there is nothing scarier. I’ve done it. When you migrate CRMs, right, you’re just like, you know, please don’t let me lose all my data.

Christopher Patton (22:32.773)
So I get that and there will be that trust building process for sure as we start rolling that out later. Right now we’re hyper focused on just this end user experience for the members. But there’s no doubt that that’s in our roadmap and I’m excited about that because I mean the chambers are just to say they’re asking for it would be an understatement.

Brandon Burton (22:53.122)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And to your point, you know, with some of these bigger companies have been around a long time with the CRMs and whatnot. When it comes to like you mentioned, lack of innovation, I think the ideas are there. They get the feedback, obviously, but it’s like turning a huge ship versus a speedboat. Right. And when you got that much more people and to weigh in on decisions and what direction to go, it just takes longer. It’s a little slower.

lot slower. So to be able to pounce on that opportunity, you’re in a great spot.

Christopher Patton (23:29.967)
Yeah, it’s something referred to as tech debt. A lot of these older tech companies, not necessarily a chamber of commerce related, but just in general, they have tech debt where they have these really old tech stacks and old code in their code base. And to roll out net new features requires a lot more work than maybe a company like mine, because we don’t have to go back and fix this popsicle stick house of

of craziness that’s been built over the years in addition to just being able to roll out a new feature. So a lot of that exists right now.

Brandon Burton (24:05.036)
Yeah, yeah, for sure. You talked about right now really focusing on that end user experience and for the chamber members, that’s what it’s all about, is giving them a good experience that’s going to keep them around, that’s going to help support their business and help them grow and thrive. So I think that’s obviously where the focus needs to be, but along the way it’s supporting chambers. I see where that continual growth and evolution will be. But yeah, I’m excited to see what comes out with the

the CRM as you guys work on that coming up in the future.

Christopher Patton (24:38.319)
Yeah, I guess I’ve kind of put it out there now. So it has to happen.

Brandon Burton (24:41.346)
That’s right now it’s real. That’s right. What other features do you want to highlight or or aspects of the app and the platform that maybe we haven’t covered yet?

Christopher Patton (24:55.896)
You know, I’d say one of the things that I like them or yeah, one of the things that comes to mind is again, like I’m trying to take that member experience, like what are the real problems they deal with and they face? And sometimes it’s basic things, right? So an example I give is like, I meet somebody at an event and then I go home right to my eight month old daughter and I completely forget that person’s name.

I cannot remember what company they work for, right? Like we’re all so busy. And you went there to network and you’re like, I can’t even remember who I networked with, right? Maybe I remember their face. So within the app, that’s where you actually do have the ability to, you see all the people you’ve connected with, very, very short term we’re gonna have you where you can see what events you met them at. So you can be like hyper focused on remembering.

Brandon Burton (25:51.147)
Christopher Patton (25:53.849)
So things like that, again, those are the problems that I feel like we’re trying to solve in that what are the problems that are audible amongst chamber members, right? In like the pain points that they have, but then also there’s that Henry Ford put, which I’ve heard he may or may not have said, which is if I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse, right? So part of this too is trying to also be innovative on my side.

Brandon Burton (26:17.208)
Try it.

Christopher Patton (26:22.573)
and come up with features that maybe members aren’t even thinking about because they don’t even know that it’s an option, right? So, you know, whether it’s in the near term checking in at events so they can see who’s at the events, right? So they know who they want to focus on talking to, you know, being able to just more intuitively search for specific industries. So like, I’m not necessarily just seeing like a business that does accounting on a directory, but I like

Brandon Burton (26:38.53)
Like that.

Christopher Patton (26:51.418)
I specifically who are the members and I can talk to them directly in the app and connect with them and try to meet with them. So again, just thinking about what is that member experience now and what could it be and really trying to digitize and improve that as much as possible without it feeling like a social network or like an online forum, right? That’s where companies go to die nowadays. So we’re not trying to do that.

Brandon Burton (27:14.04)
Yeah.

Christopher Patton (27:19.093)
Those things exist and it’s crickets. I’ve seen those with chambers of commerce. So we’re trying to do something that’s a bit more innovative.

Brandon Burton (27:27.276)
Yeah. I can see for the user to be able to see, you know, what events they connected with somebody at and over time to be able to see where are the events that are most worth my time to be at? Where do I make the best connections? And then, you know, as you continue rolling out features, if it becomes an option where I don’t know if you guys would do geo-fencing or anything at an event location, but then people show up and they get an alert of, you know, people that they’ve connected with in the past that are there and maybe, you know,

Christopher Patton (27:40.081)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (27:57.475)
rekindle those connections. So lots of exciting ways to go about it. it’s very cool.

Christopher Patton (28:02.801)
That may or may not be very short term in the road map.

Brandon Burton (28:06.604)
Yeah, right. Well, Chris, I wanted to give you an opportunity for for those listening who are wanting to take their chamber up to the next level. What kind of tip or action item might you leave for them as a suggestion to help them in that in that goal?

Christopher Patton (28:28.433)
Sure, and I appreciate the opportunity to have people even hear me out on my thought on this. Something that I find super valuable as somebody that’s like across multiple industries is dedicating time to like listen and learn both from your existing industry, right? That’s a value that you serve, right? Like if folks are CEOs or member services and they are not dedicating an hour a week,

just for learning to improve the business. You’re just in reactive mode all the time. And that’s not me chastising, that’s just something I’ve learned. I’ve got something on my calendar twice a week that’s just like education time for me, both for industry and then external industry, right? So an easy way Chambers can do this if they’re looking for outside industry time, because again, number one thing I’ll say is listen to the Chamber Chat podcast or…

Brandon Burton (29:27.054)
Great, great suggestion.

Christopher Patton (29:27.121)
You got to do that, right? Yes, yes. But as far as looking outside, right? That’s where you can learn some other technologies that, you know, chambers aren’t thinking about, or, you know, other tools that, you know, maybe could be adopted by their organization. You know, a great way to do that is just pick your AI source of choice and just like, create that business advisor, you know, get in there on an ongoing basis and dedicate that time.

So it understands who you are, what mission you’re trying to serve and what your pain points are. And keep prompting and asking more questions. Don’t give up on that. you’ll uncover things, right? Because sometimes we just, I always say like, I don’t know what I don’t know, right? So that’s why you just got to keep asking questions and keep digging. And I think that’s where sometimes all of us as business owners or business leaders, we can get a little blindsided by just what’s directly in front of us. So I think that’s probably my suggestion.

I recommend.

Brandon Burton (30:25.91)
Yeah. To your point about getting outside of the, where your blinders are kind of those other, other industries, other organizations. And I think chambers by nature do that. They kind of cross pollinate because they have to, but, my oldest kid, he’s getting ready to do course selections and stuff for his first year of college coming up. And, and he’s looking at the honors program. And I didn’t understand this, but at the school, the honors program is not just Harvard classes.

But it’s an environment where there is that cross-pollination. So you might have a certain direction with your major, but it’s like, how does that relate to mathematics or the sciences or whatever it is? you cross-pollinate from different perspectives and really work together more collaboratively too. And there’s just a lot of value in that. So I appreciate that tip.

Christopher Patton (31:14.885)
Yeah, teaching them to think and not just remember.

Brandon Burton (31:17.57)
That’s right. That’s right. Well, Chris, as we look to the future of Chambers of Commerce, how do you see the future of Chambers and their purpose going forward?

Christopher Patton (31:28.475)
Yeah, I think the way just we’re heading as a business industry, right? Like it’s impossible to not, and I hate to do this, but it’s impossible to not bring up AI, right? It’s becoming integrated and everything. So with Chambers staying relevant in their local communities and looking to

Brandon Burton (31:41.367)
Yeah.

Christopher Patton (31:58.673)
you know, like meet the needs of the next generation of business leaders, right? You know, I kind of, I kind of think of myself, I’m, I’m, I’m on the cusp, but I’m not 40 yet. And so, you know, I’m on the, I’m on that generation of business owners, right? And, know, those are the folks that, that are using AI a lot that are looking for ways to, to, you know, interact with their local business community. And I think matching that with what is a really clear need in society right now for

for community, right? And that’s something that excites me about what we’re doing, right? People are joining lots of organizations. There’s a bump again in the data of people joining organizations. So I think as chambers look down the road and they think about, sure, they service the business community, but how can they be that organization that connects people, that provides community to the people in their area?

in that sense, while also looking at some of the technologies that are coming down the pike and how they can incorporate them. I think those are two really pivotal things, We got every business always has to be looking at how can they adapt. And people my age and younger, I think have this really strong sense and desire for community because we spent so much time online, right? And so giving us…

Brandon Burton (33:21.248)
Thank you.

Christopher Patton (33:25.083)
types of people, the opportunity to network and connect with people and feel that sense of belonging I think is really important. I think chambers are really positioned in an awesome way to do that.

Brandon Burton (33:36.736)
Yeah, I would agree. would agree. Well, Chris, why don’t you share some contact information for listeners who might want to learn more about Chamber. Where would you point them? How can they connect with you to set up a demo or anything else you have to offer?

Christopher Patton (33:52.805)
Yeah, sure. My home address is, no, I’m just kidding. You can email me at patent, P-A-T-T-O-N, like the general, at chaymber.com, so C-H-A-Y-M-B-E-R (patton@chaymber.com). You can find me on LinkedIn, Christopher George Patten on LinkedIn. You can also do support at chamber.com. If you go to our website, chaymber.com, you can just simply book a meeting or check our pricing on there if you want to. So, number of ways for you to do that with ease.

Brandon Burton (33:54.786)
Yeah.

Brandon Burton (34:21.15)
Very good. And we’ll get all that linked in our show notes for this episode as well. So make it easy for people to connect with you. But this has been great. It’s a fun conversation whenever we can talk about the innovative things that are happening in the chamber space. And I’m curious to keep an eye and see the continued evolution and how you guys grow and continue to develop. But thank you for being with us today and sharing these insights and valuable resources with us.

Christopher Patton (34:48.783)
Awesome, thanks again for the opportunity.

Helping Businesses Make Money with Heather Thomson

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

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Our guest for this episode is Heather Thompson. Heather is the new Vice President of Economy and Engagement at the Edmonton Chamber of Commerce, before taking on this new role, Heather was the Executive Director for the Alberta School of Business Center for cities and communities, as part of the founding team of the center, Heather spent much of her time mentoring the next generation of business innovators while working with leaders in the business community with an emphasis on education, consulting, academic and applied research and industry outreach. A few of her key highlights through her career include being named edify his top 40. Under 40 in 2023, she employed hundreds of business students who’ve worked with more than 3000 organizations in the Edmonton region to build digital infrastructure to support their business. She secured $2 million in funding to support local business community recovery from their effects from the pandemic, and she works with national media networks to deliver consumer behavior research to the country. And she’s working on her Master’s right now in behavioral economics, but Heather, I’m excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat Podcast. I’d love for you to take a moment to say hello to all the Chamber Champions and to share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you better.

Heather Thomson 2:31
Perfect. Something interesting. Well, thank you very much for that awesome introduction, and I’m really delighted to be here. Something interesting. Okay, well, I’ll go with maybe something that’s that’s exciting in my life. I don’t interesting, but I have two small children, and, yeah, they’re four and eight, so when it’s just absolutely crazy, crazy, crazy, crazy these days, and something interesting, I have two really strong talents that I always want to brag about, because I think that they’re just I think everyone’s gonna be jealous. But I’m really good at playing blackjack, and I have this amazing sense of direction, like I know I can read a map, I can get myself into the summer. I It takes very little for me to understand direction. So I feel really excited about that. And then fun fact is that I have been to Disneyland or Disney World or Disney something adjacent, 20 times. Wow.

Brandon Burton 3:30
Yeah, it

Heather Thomson 3:31
might come up. It might come up in our conversation. So I just kind of want to, like, you know, put that out there. But yeah, you know, I live in Canada, so I’m winter girly, especially right now, as we’re recording this, it is winter time, and, yeah, that’s me in a nutshell.

Brandon Burton 3:46
Yeah. So when my wife and I first got married, we lived about 30 minutes away from Disneyland, so her sister got us an annual pass when we got married, so we probably went about 20 times that year, and I think I’ve been once or twice since, okay? So it burned me out. Okay? That was

Heather Thomson 4:04
even my question. People like people say, Well, if you had an annual pass, you’d get sick of it. And I just, I wouldn’t. I feel like I would like, Oh, I gotta go to Starbucks. I would just go to the Starbucks, to Disney, true or false. Did you get sick of it?

Brandon Burton 4:16
So I wouldn’t say I got sick of it. What it is is you feel like you’re obligated to go, like you may not feel like you want to go, but you’re like, I got this pass. It’s going to expire in two months. We need to get our money’s worth, so you’re trying to do it. But then there’s certain blackout dates for people that have passes that you can’t go. So when it’s convenient for you, you can’t go. So yeah, so there’s, there’s little catches with it, but overall, we enjoyed it. It It was fun. The best, best place in the world. Yeah. Well, tell us a little bit about the Edmonton chamber, just to give us an idea of size, staff, scope of work, budget, those kind of things you guys are involved with, with the work, just to kind of set the stage for our discussion.

Heather Thomson 4:55
Yeah, for sure. So there’s, um, yeah, we so yeah, when we move the Cham. For coming up on a year after come January, and the image and Chamber of Commerce is the second largest in Canada. It was the largest for a little while. When I say largest, I mean based on, like membership size. So we have about 1900 members, which is a fairly large size. It was actually, to be honest, I was kind of surprised when I first took over the first took over this job. I thought, you know, a chamber should be about 10% of the registered businesses within the city limits, and the city has 45,000 registered businesses. But obviously we know that number is not accurate for a variety of reasons that we can get into. But then I actually did a little bit of dicking compared to, like Calgary and Vancouver and like other sort of peer cities. And I’m like, Oh, we actually, we do have a very large chamber. And I think one of the things is that the Edmonton chamber, which is kind of fun, is that it’s the oldest organized or I guess just the organization in the city. It’s actually older than the city itself. I kind of think that’s fun. So we really lean into that as part of the brand. Something that’s unique to us right now is that we are a 99% new team. So my former business partner, Doug Griffiths, applied to be in this role, and he he was successful, became the president and CEO, and he said, Hey, I know you love working with businesses, and that’s what I was doing at the university. And he said, I think you should come over here. And then just there was so much turnover, and just like a lot of I don’t say the word messiness, but there was a lot that we needed to sort out. And so the team went from when I first started, there was four of us, and then we went to six, and so on and so on. And here we are, nine months later, and we are back up to 20, which is so exciting. And these 20 people are hand picked. Usual chambers in Canada are a team of about 26 but we’re going to keep it at about 20 because we reallocated the financial resources to kind of expand the scope of work, of what we’re asking from people, so fewer people, but probably the same amount of operating money for salaries. So that’s a very logistical detail, but just to give some insight as to why our team isn’t as big as the other teams, but tremendous capacity. So in terms of the last year has been really like everyone, hold on. I’ve been using this analogy that is felt like we have been having to we did 47 events this year that were that were attended, and it felt like we were hosting a party while we were renovating our kitchen, and no one was to know that we were renovating our kitchen. But that’s that, that was the analogy, right? So it’s like we have no resources. We didn’t have an events team. We just got an Events Manager a month ago. So it was really all hands on deck, just trying to make sure people didn’t couldn’t see all the the sawdust everywhere. And I’m really excited for 2025 because I will say this has probably been the hardest year of my, of my working life. I’m so ready for 2024 to be over. There’s a lot of, you know, three steps forward, 2.85 steps back.

Brandon Burton 8:14
So progress, though, it

Heather Thomson 8:16
is progress. And so it’s like, yeah, the year over, I can see the progress. And let’s get into 2020 but yeah, there’s, I know a few people that are like, this year, gosh, this year was, this was hard,

Brandon Burton 8:25
right? Yeah. So as far as the scope of work for the Edmonton chamber, you guys, do you have any of the Economic Development responsibility, tourism, is it strictly chamber? What does, what are you guys involved with?

Heather Thomson 8:38
Great question. It’s actually, again, another unique thing to Edmonton in that Edmonton does not have an Edmonton Economic Development Corporation. So it used to, and then what happened was it’s a subsidiary of the city of Edmonton. So what the city did was they dissolved Edmonton economic development and they put together three different entities. So they have something called Explore Edmonton, which runs, really the tourism, hospitality, marketing, branding for the city, but they also are responsible for the hosting of those events, right? So they run the convention centers, they run the expo centers, and so they have a very large mandate so that takes care of the tourism and hospitality. And then we have something called Edmonton global, which is an organization that is funded through the region actually, so not just the city of Edmonton, but all the surrounding municipalities, and they’re supposed to go out and do foreign direct investment. And it’s actually, in theory, it’s a really smart idea, because as a region, that’s how we make money. Like collaboration is where people want to invest. And so as a region, we’re really strong as Leduc county separately, or sturgeon county separately. And see in Edmonton separately, like if we just are so much stronger, you know, going after those big those big fish, when we have our whole region to promote. So that’s what Edmonton global does. And then we have. I’m still limited, which is a focus on a tech and startup incubator space. So there isn’t anyone formally in the space of economic development from a domestic standpoint, and tourism, sorry, not tourism trade accelerator and promoting our businesses to the world, outside of the country and outside of the province. And so that’s that’s our going to be our lane. So as I was saying earlier to Brandon, we are in the business of creating wealth. We’re in the business of being really proud that we want to create wealth here in Edmonton, and we want to advocate to all all orders of government, different policies. And I’ll share a policy that just came out last week, that I’m like, pulling my hair out that I’m very vocally, really against. And then we also want to make sure that we’re getting our businesses out to the world. And that’s a key part of creating wealth and creating these connection standpoints. I want, I want people to see that their membership with the Chamber is not just a historic or grandfather thing that’s part of their budget, which we have a lot of those, I want people to see like, Oh, if I’m actually not a member, like, I’m missing out. And so that’s been a core mandate for this year of 2024 we’re thinking, why are you a member? You know the fact that we’re 136 year old organization. I know that doesn’t sound that old to me, some of your your listeners, but like I said, it’s older than this. It’s really old. I would say we’re 136 year old startup and and so we have to, we have to think, why would you be a member? And I we have a lot of chambers, you know, even in the province, that are really bad, and they’re just like a cost cutting or and they’re competing for resources. And so we have to be really, really sure that if we’re going to run this chamber and we’re going to ask for money from businesses. But they are like, Yep, this is a great use of my investment, and happy to do it. I’m not doing it because I feel obligated to do Yeah,

Brandon Burton 11:49
yeah, absolutely. Well, that definitely helps set the stage for our discussion today. And I will say just a little bit of background. You mentioned Doug. Doug Griffiths, a lot of listeners are familiar with Doug because of the 13 ways to 13 ways to kill your community book, and as I had him on the podcast shoot, it’s been a couple years now, I think, since I had him on the podcast, but he he referred Heather to me to to have her on the show because of her passion for helping businesses make money, And in different ways that she’s gone about doing that, so we finally made it happen. She’s now in a position at a chamber there with Doug as well, and and that’s what we’re going to focus our conversation today on, is helping businesses make money, which I think is what every chamber should be about in one way or another. So we will dive in deep on this as soon as they get back from this quick break.

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All right, Heather, we’re back. So as I mentioned before the break, today, we’re talking about helping businesses make money. And when I think of a chamber of commerce, that should be one of the root reasons, you know, the whys for a chamber to be in existence is to help businesses thrive, and whether that’s removing obstacles or giving them key action items or training, or different ways to be able to really accelerate their business. So I’d love to dive into what your take is and maybe some strategies of how you’ve been able to help businesses really thrive.

Heather Thomson 16:35
Yeah, I think that the interesting thing, I think I was given a really unique opportunity with the pandemic. You know, just if I, if I kind of go back in time to 2020

Brandon Burton 16:49
nobody wants to do that. I know. Emily, sorry, just

Heather Thomson 16:52
bear with me. Don’t worry. We’ll, I’ll get us through to Disneyland here in a sec. Okay, yeah, it was actually worse than that. I am. I had a baby in January, little January, and the plan was that my husband was going to take, we were to share the pad leave and and in Canada, I don’t I this is so hard to hear for American listeners, but we have up to 18 months of paid maternity leave. So, you know, we just have so much so, I mean, so this, I just want to say For context, this is very unique in in Canada, this would not be unique in the United States. So we, I take, I take my mat leave. I was always going to take mat leave until about May, and then my husband was going to take over. And then COVID happened, and my husband happened to be a essential worker, so he does H back. And so this was, like a really random thing, but one of the buildings that he was looking after, I think it wasn’t the hospital. It was like a it was like to really make sure, like the bodies healthcare. Yeah, the bodies could stay cool once they were bodies, unfortunately. And that’s like a really, really morbid thing to bring up. But just to give context that I was at home now with a three year old and a colicky baby, and COVID started, so I didn’t have any help. I didn’t have any parents. It was a nightmare. And the colic, I mean, like people who joke about colic, but like, when you’re at home, I couldn’t even walk in the mall. And keep in mind, this is Canada, right? So it’s like, we’re not going outside. We’re not meeting people in the park. It’s still very cold out. So this was, like, an extremely dark, isolating time. So I was watching a lot of news, and I was seeing so many businesses close their doors and, like, that’s it. They’re they’ve gone under. And it happened really, really fast. And I remember it was, like, just around Easter of 2020, and I was actually kind of getting a bit frustrated now, at this point, because and irritated there these businesses, like, go just make a Google profile. And so it’s like, it’s easy for us to think about it now, right? Like, everyone has a Google profile, like, so easy. It’s like, of course, I’m like, yeah. But five years ago, that was not the case. So many businesses were still operating under the assumption that, like, you can find me just by walking or just by, like, you know, knowing about me through someone and now we quickly shifted as consumers were like online, online, online, and we saw firsthand the businesses that could afford it, and businesses that kind of had some sort of infrastructure or education and knowledge were able to survive this. And so it was at the end of April, I kind of, I just talking to my friend at the city of Edmonton. And I said, What’s going on here? Like, what’s the plan? And and he said, Well, I actually think that we should talk, because I have this idea. And I had a student consulting group at the University of Alberta business school that nobody was getting any work because everything, like, as you remember, like, was shut down. There was nothing happening. And I said, I can, I can mobilize students. So in a nutshell, we created the first iteration, which was making Edmonton digital. So we we got some seed money, about $300,000 in city of Edmonton through some grant funding. And I want to be really clear about this. This is something that drives me nuts. There during COVID, there was no matching grants, and I still advocate that match. Grants need to be a thing in the past. There were so many other ways to ensure that businesses or people that are applying have assurance and skin in the game. There’s so many other ways to do that. Matching grants take out like we wouldn’t be able to do if we, if we didn’t have a matching like if we, if we had to match it, yeah, yeah. Because from a university’s perspective, we can’t use operating funding. There’s just laws against it. So just to give an idea, there was no matching component to this. So we got the money, we paid the students, and within like six months, the students had worked with 800 businesses here in Edmonton to get them up online. And so we did Etsy stores, we did Google pages, we did websites like we just whatever we could. It was like a mass mobilization of getting students to build out this infrastructure. And it was, it was really great to do so, to see the students now could do something with their time and make some money. And then the and then businesses were getting up in line. The province picked it up as well. And so we were able to expand it, and then it turned into closer to, like, two and a half million dollars in about 3500 businesses by the time we were done. It actually just ended this past fall, and so it was a really cool opportunity to look at COVID and being irritated with the news. And I have this thing where I like to take my personal irritations and turn them into, like, my new professional project. But I was, I have to say I was, it was so I was so fortunate, because I was offering in a time where the answers were Yes, right, I was hitting so many low hanging fruit for the government to find right. I was, I was employing youth. 70% of the people we were working with identified as some sort of minority group, and our target was a quarter. So like, you could just see, like we were just like, the government was like, yes, yes, yes. And we were able to provide such a larger, you know, return of of investment on what the government’s money was for us. So it’s been really cool to see that that program come from A to Z, and now we have to think, Well, COVID is done. Everyone we laugh. We’re like, oh, yeah, of course. Everyone has a Google page. It’s like, yeah, of course. But this notion of democratizing digital assets and digital tools and education wasn’t a thing before 2020 it was expensive. Businesses didn’t know how to do it. And now here we are, five hours, five hours

Brandon Burton 22:20
later. It seems like it’s sometimes five, yeah,

Heather Thomson 22:25
five years later. And this knowledge is just this, AI, like, we just were able to do this so quickly. So now we have so many things we have to do next. We have to think about this is going to be the next thing that we have to jump through and, like, I like that saying where it’s never been as hard as it is today to run a business, but it will never be this easy again, and so we have to kind of just readjust that whole like things are not going to get easier. We need to get better.

Brandon Burton 22:52
Yeah, I love that story, that background, being able to catch that vision and see where there’s a, you know, holes in the marketplace and being able to see, hey, there’s access to funds here. Let’s partner. Let’s, let’s get these students out to work and help these businesses and, and I’ve mentioned it before on the podcast, even where, even just, you know, brick and mortar retail businesses that have been that way for decades, maybe that have never explored having an online store Shopify or something like that, and just the the limits are, it becomes limitless when you can shift that way. It just becomes a matter of keeping up inventory and being able to ship and that sort of thing. But those people who can make that conversion from just brick and mortar to brick and mortar and online are going to be the ones that thrive and and really do well going into the future. Yep, so you had mentioned trying to think about some of those things or what’s next. You know, as far as how business evolves and how technology impacts business, are there some trends that you have an eye on right now that that you’re seeing is, I think this could be something to pay attention to.

Heather Thomson 24:07
Yeah, and it’s interesting, because I think I was just actually doing quite a bit of data on this. In 2022 and 2023 we were looking at space right? So now we’re looking at space of how consumers are shopping, and what we’re seeing for the first time. And this is like all but like, I’m not gonna say us economists. I’m not there yet. Man, I can’t wait to be. But a lot of economists and a lot of retailing academia, we’re just nerding out over this point of data. It’s so cool that for the first time in human history, we have more purpose driven consumers than we do value driven consumers. And so just to explain what that is, a value driven consumer are the people that care the most about like their dollar, right? They want to, they want to set, they want that dollar to go as far as possible. They’re couponing. They’re they’re about that. I. And then you have the purpose driven consumer. And so these are the consumers that are their time, and they want the great experience. And so what we’re seeing here is this is a clear cut demographic shift we’re seeing in the marketplace from the spending power. So you have people, really under the age of 45 that are the purpose driven consumers that are taking up way more space in the marketplace. And you have the baby boomers, who are the quintessential value driven consumers that are leaving right? They’re they’re not. And that’s the other thing. Like we they like baby boomers have, which are people born between 1946 to 1964 these, these individuals have more wealth per person than anyone has ever had in the history of humankind. But they’re not spending the money, right? Like, you know, who’s spending the money? It’s millennials, millennials. So those are people with 1981 to 1997 and so we’re having, and I’m generalizing here, right? We should look at the data from minerus or visa or something like that, and you’re gonna see this. And so what’s happening with that is that, how we are setting up our business world, how we are providing value for the consumer, is a really interesting time right now, because what worked seven years ago isn’t working today. And yes, there’s the pandemic, sure. Because, to your point, Brandon around you know brick and mortar needs to have an online like, Yes, right? We know that, but we also know that the consumer, from a data perspective, actually enjoys shopping in person. So I want to make that very clear. People have this notion like, I can’t compete with Amazon. I’m like, Yes, you can. You 100% compete with Amazon, and you should. Amazon leaves a lot to be desired. But what, what the problem is, is that people are thinking, I can’t compete with Amazon, because I’m a distribution center. I am a Toys R Us, where you just have a shelf and a product. Yeah, you will not compete with Amazon. You will go out of business. So anytime a business is kind of gearing towards come and buy something from me, I have a product, come and purchase it from me. Those are the businesses that are going to die. So because of this, we need way less square footage. We don’t need, you know, 5000 square foot retail days. And I remember when I worked at Lululemon, we needed a lot of space. We needed a big back room to house two weeks worth of inventory on hand. That’s not how retail works anymore. Retailers and businesses like you just need less space to operate, and that’s through sophisticated shipping. But now in North America, we have about 30% too much space. If you look at malls, we’re seeing this across the world. Malls, unless they’re extraordinary, are they’re like, they’re so depressing to look at, right? They are just they’re not, they’re not of value anymore. And even in Canada, where we have a winter climate, unless a mall is getting some serious investment and some serious diversification, they are the now the land the mall sits on is what is actually valuable, not the mall itself. Yeah, and so we’re seeing this really critical shift from how are we utilizing our space? Office market is no different. We just need less space, but we’re also in a housing crisis. And so one of the big projects that we’re going to be tackling now is, how are we right sizing our physical space to make sure that we are able to invest in residential housing? Because that’s such a critical we learned this from the pandemic. If there’s no residential base, the city is done. You’re that area you’re in is done from an economic standpoint, but we also need to make sure that we’re building the right the right things, but we’re also taking the things that are on the market currently, because it has worked for 40, 5060, years, and it doesn’t work anymore. We need to make sure that those spaces are being retrofitted to work for today. And this is a whole thing that we are hearing in very in all the provinces, who should pay for it. And so one of the things our neighbors to the south Calgary has done is that they created, this was before COVID. I just want to point that out. It was in 2018 they had a downtown residential investment, or it, sorry, yeah, investment incentive. So if somebody were to take over a building that was an office space, because keep in mind, this is Calgary. It’s 2018 they have 50% office vacancy. They said they put 150 million that if a developer were to take a building and turn it from office to residential, they would get $75 a square foot to do that, which is people like, that’s that’s, why are we getting tax dollars to developers? Well, I’ll tell you why. Now, Calgary weathered COVID better than any other Canadian city, and they’re the downtown that has rebounded the fastest in North America. They had a residential population. Edmonton had 60,000 people coming downtown every day to were a government town, yeah, well, that’s only 12,000 people who live down here. It’s 12 square kilometers. We have the hardest hit downtown. And so it’s just interesting, this whole notion of how we are now advocating that we’re in the situation. We need to figure out housing, we need to figure out space, and we need to use tax dollars to get us out of it. And it’s very. Very controversial, but we ultimately, there’s no there’s not going to be a higher return on investment than figuring out the space. Yeah, that

Brandon Burton 30:07
is a that’s an interesting problem to solve and to address. I really am intrigued on the comment you made about the being purpose driven economy more so than a value driven economy. Now, and those that that do value, the value driven aspects are the ones that are not spending the money necessarily. So, you know, in a world where you know the Walmarts and Amazons have done so well because they offer the best value, how can a chamber business or a retail business, how can they lean more into that experiential, purpose driven type of economy?

Heather Thomson 30:49
It’s a great question. And this was something we came up when we were working with businesses, when I was at the university, because it’s really hard to have a business do something for 40 years, and it worked for 40 years, and all of a sudden it doesn’t, yeah, so I think the thing, the thing is, is that there’s so many different ways that you can add elements of purpose and a great experience, and without it being flashy and expensive. You know, I think one of the things that we’re that we’re seeing as as simple as possible, is just a better customer service. And this is something that, and this is the, I don’t know if the states has this problem, but in Canada, we are having a really difficult problem with our labor force, and due to a lot of injections throughout the COVID money, the younger like our unemployment numbers are made up a lot of new newcomers to Canada because our immigration, federal immigration plan was so flawed, and Canada has actually been a taste like a test case for a lot of other countries who are like, Don’t do this. Like we put so much emphasis in bringing on so many new people to Canada, which is great, but there wasn’t a lot of thought to it. So half of our unemployment rate federally is is with new newcomers to Canada. And I just can’t imagine being a new person coming to Canada and being kind of like, sold on this, like, new place to live, and not having a job. I would be like, it’s so many we’re going back, and it’s, it’s such an economic and social travesty that we have to, we have to deal with. And it and it is, it’s, you know, and the and the other half of that is young people. I didn’t see the other half, another large portion of the of the unemployment rate are young people. And what we’re, what we’re hearing, is actually a willingness to work situation. So this is, I’m curious to know, if you guys are seeing this the United States. We

Brandon Burton 32:39
are. Yeah, yeah. It seems like when COVID hit and a lot of stimulus money went out, all of a sudden people didn’t need to work. And I don’t know how they made the stimulus money last for four years, but they apparently still don’t need to work. So they still don’t need

Heather Thomson 32:52
to work. It’s crazy, yeah, and so, and that’s where, like, the customer service angle, to get back to that, that’s a hard one. You know, customer service is something that is dwindling in terms of, you know, something that we would even expect as as consumers. But so when people are like, What can I do? And like, do better customer service? Start there, and that’s anything from, like, I know there’s a pharmacy down the road, and they’re very sweet. They’ve been doing that forever from our house, and now they just have a sign, like, we’ll deliver. I’m like, great. I’m going from Safeway, I’m coming over to you. And it’s just like, they had all this extra time, and they have teenage kids, and so they’re like, we’re just, we’re gonna send them out deliver. Like, great. And so it’s just like a very small thing that it’s like, okay, that’s easy, because what we’re wanting to do is people are prioritizing their time. That’s what we’re seeing in this modern economy. And so this isn’t about convenience is going to win, right? So this is where I’m saying, like, you don’t need to go to bat with Amazon. You don’t need don’t worry about that. Convenience is really important, for sure, but I think there’s kind of a rule where you have to make it you have to make it easy, you have to make it fun, or you have to make it beautiful. So go in those categories. The beautiful one, I think, is really overlooked. And I actually get this is something I get really frustrated with, because whether you’re a value driven consumer or purpose driven consumer, people really enjoy beautiful spaces, pretty spaces. And so this is where, like, I actually have a podcast that talks solely about twinkle lights and the psychological point of twinkle lights, like, there’s my Disney reference, like, Main Street, right? Like you just, they have the perfect twinkle lights. And if you go down Main Street, you know, I just love it, because you see the garbage cans, or exactly, was it 10 feet away from one another? They had the blade signs. They have the good smell. And it’s, of course, it’s a simulated environment. I understand that, but there’s so many elements,

Brandon Burton 34:45
something to aspire to, though, exactly, I do

Heather Thomson 34:48
have to say that I know it’s a simulated environment. I don’t think any of us would actually want to live there, because it’s like creepy and pleasant Philly, but there are so you’re right, the cleanliness, the twinkle lights, you know when we. Were working with businesses during the pandemic. They’re like, I can’t keep up. And this one, one person was a forest, which, by the way, forest did very well during COVID. So I just want to say that. And this guy was like, yeah, we’re just we were sinking. We’re not getting any money. And I go there, your store is disgusting, like the windows are disgusting. Your light bulbs are burnt out. That is why you’re not making money, I can guarantee you, especially when you’re like, when you’re unfortunately, when you’re like, a Hair Studio, nail place, anything that is lending itself to already improving esthetics, well, guess what? You have to make it look even better. So there’s just, there’s a lot of things that we need to do that can actually bring that sort of purpose element. And it doesn’t have to be this Disneyland mentality or the budget, but I think that that is one of those things where businesses can actually just kind of get back to some nostalgia and get back to what’s really what used to work, even in the 50s and 60s, because people data is very clear that people are wanting those experiences.

Brandon Burton 35:58
Yeah, well, and to your point as we make as a chamber. If we can get members and retail businesses to create the easy, fun and beautiful environments and experiences, it’s going to reflect very well on our community as well, and it’s going to be welcoming. It’s going to be a place where people want to come from outside to spend money in the community as well. So it doesn’t just help the business, but it helps the overall community

Heather Thomson 36:24
Exactly. And wealth begets wealth. And I want that to be like a bumper sticker everywhere. People are thinking, Well, no, if they get it, then I don’t get it. I’m like, No. Like, can you imagine if Nashville was, like, only one music studio that’s like, no. It’s like, it’s empirically false. Yeah,

Brandon Burton 36:40
it’s not a pie so, right? Well, Heather, this has been very fun to dive into this and hear some of these ideas and research and things that that you’ve noticed, these trends that are happening, good things for chambers, listening to kind of ponder on and to see how they can implement and make some adjustments within their community. But I wanted to ask you, as we start wrapping things up for the chamber listening, who’s wanting to take their organization up to the next level, what kind of tip or action item might you share with them trying to accomplish that goal?

Heather Thomson 37:19
That’s a very, good question. I think depending on your community gaps, one of the good things, a challenge about being a Chamber of Commerce is the umbrella of value is very large, and so that’s kind of what we had to figure out here, is like we can’t be everything for everyone, and we can’t do everything. So what are we going to do that’s really impactful and kind of ignore the rest? And so I would say, figure out what’s not being done in the ecosystem and then go and fill that that gap. And thankfully, in our in our case, it was in sad case, we are not we don’t get a penny from the government. So we can be the advocate that the business community needs us to be. So we can, we can we can talk about, you know, just give you the example I was kind of alluding to. Federally, they’re removing GST for two months, starting tomorrow, over the holidays. This podcast is being done, you know, at the end of 2024 and, yeah, they’re removing GST for two months. And this is in, like, absolutely awful. It’s the worst thing we can do for the economy. Business community hates it, so it’s kind of fun, because it’s such a layup for us to, like, be such a stark advocate that this is so bad. But that’s the space we’re really leaning into. And so if we’re looking at, how are you going to be successful? Like, pick something and do it really well, whether, like, I know, a chamber of commerce, just just to the south of us, there are regional, there are massive Regional Chamber of Commerce, which I also recommend, by the way, if you’re struggling for resources, amalgamate. Like, like, you know, I know, like, someone has to fall on the sword, but just do it. But they, they, they are so great at networking. They are like, the hottest ticket in town. They are the ones that are like, come to this event. We’ve got you. You got to learn this. So their big thing is, like, education and networking and growing your your business through other people. So, so, yeah, we do lots of partnerships, and that’s the thing. Like, I don’t, I don’t need to do that, because they’re doing it. And so that’s the thing where it’s like, just figure out what you need to do.

Brandon Burton 39:27
Yeah? I like that. Find the gaps and lean into them and own

Heather Thomson 39:31
them. Yeah, yeah. And then ask for money. Yeah. I love it.

Unknown Speaker 39:34
I love that idea. I know

Heather Thomson 39:37
it’s so easy. Once you have a good idea, it’s always true. Like, well, let’s ask for money. I’m like, no, what do you like? Make the good idea first, then you can find funding. Funding is actually quite easy. I’ll say in Canada, when you have a purpose, when you have a purpose, but yeah, or and if they could get rid of matching grants,

Brandon Burton 39:52
yeah, yeah, that too. Well, Heather, as we look to the future of chambers, how do you see the future of chambers of commerce and their purpose going? Forward.

Heather Thomson 40:00
Oh, this is tough. If you’d have asked me this, like, two years ago, I’d be like, chambers probably aren’t long for this world. And I still feel like that from just from a risk standpoint, because there are so many member based organizations, right? It feels like I turn around and there’s another one and there’s another one, it’s like, Well, I’m a member of, you know, the Urban Development Institute. Now I’m a member of the Edmonton construction Association, and they’re all, they’re all money based memberships, and that’s the other thing that’s really tricky. And so I think that’s one of the biggest risks that we have, is like, how are we competing with them, making sure that our membership is the best membership, and and I think we have some ground to make up for that, certainly. And so I think as long as we we can do that and actually be what the business community needs us, and at the end of the day, producing results that are getting more money in the in the region, and I think, I think we’re good. And the other thing I would say is we have such an active membership and board, and I think that’s one of those things where it’s like, kind of that fear of missing out being part of a club with there’s so many different member orgs. Like, I honestly can make like a Disney moms in Edmonton Association, right? Like, there’s nothing to stop you. Yeah, nothing to stop them. In fact, I think I might

Brandon Burton 41:23
it’s a great idea. Yeah, exactly. But like

Heather Thomson 41:25
with the internet and even, like podcast, like anyone can do it, and so I think that’s one of the things that I’m, like, quite nervous about, is like, how are people choosing us? How are we the number one stop, and how are we worth the money? Yeah, yep.

Brandon Burton 41:39
Goes back to finding those gaps in the community and owning them and standing apart showing the value. Well, Heather, this has been a great conversation, and I really appreciate you spending time with us today. I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for listeners who might want to reach out and learn more about your approaches and how you guys are doing things there in Edmonton. What would be the best way for them to reach out and connect? Reach out and

Heather Thomson 42:04
connect my email is actually probably the best. So it’s, it’s Heather, no, it’s not. That’s probably know it I’ve been here for 10 months. It’s hthomson@edmontonchamber.com. Yes.

Brandon Burton 42:22
I can double check it for you. We’ll get it in the show notes either way, so we’ll make it easy for people to find and be able to reach out to you. But Heather, I just want to thank you again for spending time with us. This has been fun. It’s insightful and really forward leaning as we we look at these types of experiences people are looking for as they interact with the retail businesses in our communities and and really seeing where those needs are to be able to help businesses make money to prove the value of the chamber, but having our communities thrive as well. So I really appreciate you spending these these few moments with us and sharing these insights. Well, thank

Heather Thomson 43:01
you so much for having me. I clearly could talk about this all day, and I know we’re all even though we’re all pretty geographically spread out, I know that we are kind of all singing from the same song sheet and having a lot of similar problems. So I appreciate your time as well.

Brandon Burton 43:17
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Newnan-Coweta Chamber-2024 Chamber of the Year Finalist with Candace Boothby

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Brandon Burton 0:00
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You’re joining us for a special episode in our 2024 ACCE Chamber the Year Finalist Series and our guests for this episode is Candace Boothby. Candace is the President and CEO of the Newnan-Coweta Chamber in Georgia. It’s a position she’s held for almost 21 years. She is a certified chamber executive, the top professional certification nationally and only one of two CCEs in Georgia. Candace is known for high energy and innovative approach to organizational management traits which assist her in developing many successful initiatives. Her ongoing commitment to excellence resulted in the Newnan-Coweta Chamber receiving the coveted Five Star accreditation from the US Chamber of Commerce and maintaining it for the past 16 years, placing it in the top 1% of chambers nationwide. In 2015. Through her leadership, the Newnan-Coweta Chamber was named the National Chamber of the Year the first chamber in Georgia to receive this designation. Professionally, Candace received her accreditation and public relations in 2002. Graduated from with her IOM in 2005 received her Georgia certified chamber executive recognition in 2007. And in 2013 obtained her CCE designation. She has served on numerous community and professional boards throughout her career including the chair of the Georgia Association Chamber of Commerce in 2013 to 2014 and two terms on the ACCE Board of Directors where she also has chaired the Chamber of the Year program and currently chairs and currently chairs the Fringe Benefits Inc board. In 2021. She was named the Legacy Award recipient by her Georgia peers.

A Texas native Candace. His career spans 37 years 35 of them in Georgia after graduating from Baylor in Waco, Texas. With her Bachelor of Arts degree in journalism, she got her start in chamber work at the Greater Killeen Chamber in Texas. She brightened her background by working for a State Technical College at a Baptist Hospital, a large metro Atlantic public school system and community not for profit. Before coming to the Newnan-Coweta Chamber in September 2003, which became the third chamber she served.

Candace, I’m excited to have you with us today on chamber tap podcast. Congratulations to you and your team for being selected as a Chamber of the Year Finalist again, this is very exciting, but wanted to give you a chance to say hello to all the Chamber Champions who are out there listening and to have you shared something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better.

Candace Boothby 3:59
Well, it’s great to be here. Thank you and I were sharing earlier, this is my second time to visit with you. And I want to just give a shout out to everybody out there and chamber world. We all know how much we love what we do. And I think that reflection of that is when you do get moments in time opportunities like this. But like you said, I’ve been in my current community 21 years in September. I love what I do as much as I did the very first moment I started in the chamber industry. We all know there are ups and downs that it gets in your blood, and it just doesn’t go away. So we do have an organization we’re about 740 Plus members give or take whatever day of the week. It is our budgets a little over a million dollars. We are located about 25-30 minutes south of Hartsfield Jackson airport. So I like to say I’m, we’re close enough to the gravitational pull of Atlanta to take advantage of all their benefits. But we have a sense of place and a sense of community that’s uniquely ours. So I am proud to be where I am today talking with you. And something interesting. I think you said Brandon about me. Okay, so I’m native Texan San Antonio was my home. I have family in Waco and Macedonia has and variety of places and the only family member to have left. The one day I just happened to be I went down a rabbit hole, following a chamber member who was on a genealogy trip. And I thought, Well, why don’t I just click on My great grandmother whose name was gravestone, Spearman, and I knew that she had connections to Georgia. And she married a man from Louisiana, and they settled in East Texas, Pittsburgh, if anybody knows where that is. And so I did. I googled her. And I recognized my grandmother and all her brothers and sisters on that page was very detailed, was clearly my family. And so I thought, well, let me click on her mother. And I did and I discovered that my great great grandmother was born right here in 1845. And can’t wait Academy. Which What are the odds? Right, so then I clicked on her parents. And I discovered that her father is buried in our historical cemetery across the street from the chamber. That’s like my great, great, great grandfather. So here I am, native Texan, moved to Georgia, when I was 22 ended up in this community and the pleasure of being able to serve here for so many years, discovering that I’m from here, originally. So it’s kind of like one of those moments, I got all excited, because I’m like, what, how many generations is that, and, you know, you have a lot of communities depending on where they are in their lifecycle that might have a lot of history. And you have to be born here, or your grandfather has to be born here, you know, for you to be actually considered from that community. Right? Yeah. And so when I did my math, I called up one of my board members who I knew was one of the older families in town. I think he was eight, eight and a half generations, something like that. And I use 20 generations as my litmus. So I did my math. I called him up. And I said, Hey, Garnett, how many generations are you? And he told me and I said, Well, I told him what store and I said, well, guess what? I win.

Then I told my board chair at the time, and he said, Oh, you’re a homing pigeon. So I feel like that’s why I’ve always felt an affinity for Noonan and Kavita County. It’s been my blood. And they’re no joking, right? Literally.

Brandon Burton 8:01
Yeah, I’m assuming the chamber office as long as you’re there, it can never move because that gravitational pole to that historical cemetery across the street.

Candace Boothby 8:10
Thank you. Yes. There’s a lot of gravitational poles going on.

Brandon Burton 8:13
That’s right. That’s right. Now that’s awesome. How do you guys say, sounds like great chamber, obviously being selected as a chamber, the year finalist again, after winning back in 2015. And that speaks a lot to your chamber and to the the repetitive nature of being able to be selected and to be able to rise to the top of the ranks among chambers again, so great job to you guys. And I’m excited to dive into this episode with you and really spend time talking about the two programs that were submitted on your chamber the year application, and we’ll dive into those as soon as we get back from this quick break.

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All right, Candace, we’re back. So as I mentioned before the break, we’ll spend most of our time today talking about the two programs on your chamber, the your application, if you would like to introduce the first program to us, and we will dive into that and kind of the origins and how that became something of interest for you guys to take on. And we’ll explore that topic, but please introduce it.

Candace Boothby 11:05
Okay. So the first program is the Forward Coweta Summit. Originally, we were calling it the growth summit that, you know, that has different connotations, so we just called it the Forward Coweta Summit. The purpose of this program is really just to educate the citizens create civic engagement and conversation around key topics. So we are a very fast growing community. We’re fortunate in the sense that our governments have made really good decisions over the years. So our growth has not outpaced us. But we’re kind of at that tipping point. And so we also have such a younger generation, it’s important that we bring them into the dialogue in the conversation. So we have actually used the forward can we to summit as a platform to really strategically engage a younger audience. We’ve got several tools that we’ve put into place as a result of that. We started big picture the first year, which was last year. And it brought in some really cool speakers throughout the metropolitan Atlanta area, just to talk about what they’re doing in their community, how they managed growth, what they did in certain areas, how do you create the sustain of vision, this year, we’re actually narrowing it just a little bit. And we are going to focus a little bit more on talent retention and recruitment, in addition to quality of life. So we had great participation, we a lot of strategies on the front end, where we went out and did one on one conversations with each of our elected officials in Jena to personally invite them to be there that day, we had great success doing that. Then we sent out a calendar invite, gosh, probably five, six months in advance. And then as we got closer, we we actually had hired a company to do our marketing. And so we did a very aggressive marketing campaign. Leading up to that day, we had about 300 that participated. And it was the right people to be in the room, which was our, our goal, because we wanted all the key stakeholders in the community, you know, and again, when you do something new like this, people are thinking, what are they doing? Why are they doing it? What’s the purpose, but we have done an Inner Inner community visit right before COVID, which was our first and so kind of dipping our toe into putting that conversation table together, if you will, around future issues. So it’s all a part of a bigger strategy, because if you look at our mission, it’s all about championing economic prosperity. And so this, we don’t do anything that’s not aligned with our mission. And we certainly get asked a lot by different people to do a variety of things, as most chambers do. That this one is probably one of my favorite programs, because it does bring all the right people together to the table to hear the information that you want to want them to hear to start the dialogue. And so this year, we did put a group of young next gen leaders to help they introduced the speakers last year and and have been a part of the process just giving feedback. And so now when this year is over, we’re going to start putting some We haven’t decided what we’re going to call a bit probably a little I don’t know conversation groups to break down some of the topics. And probably one of our biggest goals, outcomes that we’re looking for long term is more private investments. So we have a lot of investment by our government. And it’s fantastic. But we know that in order to really, I guess implement a bigger greater vision, it’s going to require more private invest MIT. So that’s, that’s kind of where we’re headed with all the conversation.

Brandon Burton 15:06
I love that I love having those goals to work forward in the picture of what you want next year to look like. And the idea of being able to bake in some other key factors to how a chamber operates. Like you mentioned, how can the next gen leaders introduce speakers and getting them involved and feel like they have a place in the community and with the chamber? In particular, I love that. You mentioned having the marketing company kind of create the campaign and get 300 participants and being the right people and says you’re considering the stakeholders that you wanted to be there? What did that look like? Who all did you want in the room? And then how did the marketing go out? Or is it open to the community? And at at large? Or was it targeted towards certain demographics of some sort? Or how did how was that planned out and thought through. So

Candace Boothby 15:57
it was open to the community at large, although we didn’t target the community at large. It was certainly open. Our number one stakeholder was our county commission and our city council, starting with the mayor and the county commission, Chairperson, because that’s, that’s where the rubber meets the road. And those are our most important community partners. So that’s where we started. And then we sort of backed our way into meeting with several of the county commissioners, the city council members, and we sort of backed our way into less formally, making sure that we had representation from our school board, from some of our smaller municipalities. And then we turned our attention to some of the larger industries. So we have a lot of internal groups within the chamber. So of course, while we’re doing a lot of the personal outreach, all of our target groups within the chamber as well as our members at large, they were the recipient, the target groups received the calendar invite. And then the bigger broader audience received the Save the date postcard, which came out five months in advance, and then the targeted emails. And then I think our social media campaign kicked in the event was the end of August, though it kicked in. Gosh, I can’t remember I want to say it was the mid to latter part of July. So it’s the last Wednesday in October, so you weren’t planning for this year. And in looking at last year’s timing, we’ve readjusted this year schedule just a little bit. So the calendar invites went out earlier, the Save the date cards are actually going out today. And the social media campaign will kick in mid July, and we haven’t heavily started promoting that will kick in the week after July 4. And, and then from that moment forward, we’ll be having conversations with people. And there is another group that I failed to mention, we did a survey during the events and before the event and after the event. And there were 50 people that that indicated they would like to be involved in this process. So while we’ve communicated with them, we haven’t done anything formal. So when this timeframe rolls around two to three weeks prior to that we’re going to connect with that group, and give them an assignment during the conference or during the summit, to listen for certain things. So that afterwards, we can get them together and do a larger debriefing than what we did last year with just our smaller next gen group.

Brandon Burton 18:42
Wow, I really liked that idea of being able to. So how was that question phrased on the survey then to because they can see, you know, do you want to get involved that can mean a whole lot of different things about what involvement might look like in a summit like this,

Candace Boothby 18:57
that haven’t looked at it in a while. But if I remember, I think it was something like this more gauging their interest in the topic and the conversation and desire to be engaged in conversation moving forward about where we’re growing as a community. So it was rather broad. But the fact that we have that many people that actually said, Yes, I was a little surprised, because that’s your built in audience right there.

Brandon Burton 19:24
It is. I imagine if you if you needed somebody you could pull from that group for one of the conversation groups that you’re talking about doing or something that you have a pool of people that are willing and want to be more involved. So I love that idea.

Candace Boothby 19:38
Thank you.

Brandon Burton 19:39
Yeah. Well, let’s shift gears a little bit to the other program on your chamber. The your application was called go digital. That Correct? That’s it. Tell us what that’s about and kind of the origins and how that’s been developed?

Candace Boothby 19:54
said go digital. We were very fortunate. Our county administer Strader approached me, I lose track of time, sometime you’re in a year ago, you’re gonna have to go about the ARPA funds into the American rescue plan funds. And he said that they were going to earmark just shy of a million dollars for the chamber. But we had to submit the traditional grant, which we did. And then we received two grants. One was for a talent development program. And the other one was for good digital. And I think we had about 400,000 applied to the go digital program. So I love this program. Because what it’s done, we were able to identify, during COVID, there were a lot of our small businesses, because they did not have an online e commerce presence, they were not able to, to really be as successful as they could have been otherwise. So we targeted companies who needed help with their digital assets, specifically, but not exclusively, online, e commerce. So we have a fantastic volunteer, he used to be our board chair, he’s retired senior VP of Finance for Yamaha just does a lot of great stuff with us. So he has been the project leader since the beginning. And he put together a group of digital asset providers, so member companies, and actually, I guess they were all members, we get a little loose about that, like, for instance, on the grant side, you did not have to be a chamber member to receive a grant. And we want to help all companies. And if it’s an opportunity for us, then to expose the chamber to somebody maybe and then turn them into a member. That’s, that’s great, that he pulled together a group of probably eight providers that worked on, you know, developing websites, and social media campaigns and all the things video that you would consider part of the digital assets. So they created the criteria. And they created everything, all the requirements. So there were requirements were the company that applied had to go through training. They only got a percentage of the money on the front end. And they had to complete the project before they received the remaining money. And so we were able to help. And the grants ranged from 2500. To just shy of 20,000, I believe, we were able to help a little over 60 companies believe we’ve given up most of the money we saw, we were able to get just a little bit more transferred over from our other grants into digital aid. So we can do a bit more this year. One of our providers, I thought did something quite clever. So we do a total resource campaign in the fall. One of our products is called other chambers do this as well try it Tuesday, and where we Wednesday, where you go out and you film them. And you see you try that you film them with trying something or show us what you’re doing depending on which day you purchased. And then we put those videos out on social media, we have a page on our chamber website, we promote them to our members. So one of these providers used some of her grant money for her clients to purchase them. These videos, which helped us out I didn’t know she was doing it until much later on. I thought this is brilliant. So when you look at our schedule for the trial to see where we Wednesdays throughout the year, probably of the 24 I’m going to say that at least 12 Or her clients. Wow. And so it’s enabled them to be able to get video for their websites at a very, very well. They didn’t pay for it because it came with a grant. And then we partnered with one of our providers. And he does all of our video for us. So it gives it a little bit more of a professional look. That’s been a great program. It’s it’s, we did a cover story on the program in our Thrive publication back in March. And there’s this big photo of all lay they weren’t all there. But most of the grant recipients are sitting on the wall in front of the courthouse and standing and the courthouse is right there in the background. And they’re waving at the camera. And then on the inside was a wonderful story about some of the outcomes. Some of the companies who talked about just having access to this grant and implementing it how much it’s helped their company grow. So that’s the stories that we tell now is the success stories. Yeah,

Brandon Burton 24:51
I love that. And that gives you a ton of content to tell stories over and over and impact the Chamber’s making it

Candace Boothby 24:59
I have to tell you a sidebar though. Have you seen that cover that magazine?

Brandon Burton 25:03
I have not? No. It’s on our website. Yeah. So that’s me, and I’ll put it in our show notes for this episode too. So people, when

Candace Boothby 25:11
you look at it, it’s the most beautiful blue sky and the most beautiful cherry tree and full bloom. So when we took that photo, it was February. And the tree had no leaves, the grass was ground. And it was it was kind of a gray day. And so I sent it there is a company that we occasionally use in St. Simons called 365 degrees marketing, they do such an amazing work with photos. And they, they’re the ones that created our logo and brand 15 years ago. So I sent him this photo, and I said, this is gonna go on the cover of thrive, and I need it to have your colors featured. So they and I said, I just need a few leaves on the tree and, you know, give the sky you’re pretty blue. Will they sent it back. And the tree was it didn’t just have leaves, it was a cherry tree and full blue. And the sky was this beautiful shade of cobalt blue. And the court has got a lovely new roof. The grass was green, I stare at that cover and pay cash. That’s the prettiest picture ever.

Brandon Burton 26:19
That’s great. That’s a way to sell the community. Right? Your dress? Yeah, that’s awesome. No, it’s so important for businesses to be able to have their online presence to be able to have their ecommerce sites if they’re a retail store, you know, have products that they sell in a brick and mortar, to be able to sell them as out the back door, as we say. And I forget what the stats are. But the percentage of sales that go online versus brick and mortar is it can be, you know, double or triple within store sales are if they’re set up in the right way. And the community is

Candace Boothby 26:57
huge. Yeah, well, here’s one example. So downtown in the square, the Noonan square, there’s this chocolate shop, that it’s it’s let them eat toffee. And they had no website. So when COVID hit, give a love their chocolate, and so they were calling them, you know, and that’s a bit of a challenge. So they were one of the first ones to sign up to be a part of this program. And it has made a world of difference in their ability to expand their customer base.

Brandon Burton 27:28
I bet. So with how the funds from the grant were set up, was there anything that goes into training on how to make that conversion from vo to be able to sell online? Because that’s it’s different right than doing business, just bringing someone up at the cash register versus having the logistics to be able to pull the product and package and ship and assuming that’s the type of business that they are and where they’re shipping material. But how do those that you talked about the eight, the eight providers? Did they provide some of that training and get them up and going with that the grant

Candace Boothby 28:06
there? Yes, there was required training before they applied for the grant. Okay, so as far as drilling down that deeply into onto the E commerce side, I’d have to ask Phil, that question. But I know that there was a needs assessment that was done. And when specifically like the websites were created. So here’s a great example, there’s a travel agency that didn’t have a great online presence. And so when they were done, they had not just the online presence, but the tools to take it to the next level. So I think it was probably a case by case basis, once they went through the first training based on what their needs were.

Brandon Burton 28:53
Yeah, I can see that. That’s such a great idea to be able to, to kind of tag some of those ARPA funds for this type of work to be able to get businesses online and, and like I said before, it makes such a huge impact into the community and for those businesses and they have families and they’re earning a living and all these things just helps perpetuate that throughout your community.

Candace Boothby 29:18
I will tell you this, I think one of the things, least for me, and other people that I talked to, that they’ve enjoyed most about it is for the ones that now have the video that was filmed as a part of either try it Tuesday or Wednesday. That has been eye opening for me because it’s allowed me to be able to go form a different kind of relationship with some of these companies. So there’s a lady that has goats and she makes goat’s milk and she’s got a beautiful storefront in downtown soy. So you know being able to go visit and see her product and when I interviewed her I got to hold the nine day old goat by the name of Daphne A which was kind of cool. And I would never have known about like the dent guy or the junk sweepers. But then to actually be able to sit down with them and drill down, it’s given us another outlet to get to know our members, you know, just a little bit better at a different in a different way.

Brandon Burton 30:18
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think we could go down a whole rabbit rabbit hole of the trade Tuesdays Wednesdays and, and I’m sorry, we don’t have more time, because I know that people listening are like, tell us more about that. Tell us more. But as we start to wrap things up, I do like to ask, especially with you guys being a chamber, the year finalist again, you guys are doing something, right. So for the chambers out there who wants to take their chamber up to the next level, what kind of tip or action item might you share with them and trying to accomplish that goal.

Candace Boothby 30:50
So I’m gonna have to go back to my roots. So I’m a big believer in systems and processes. And I think back to, I don’t know, when I first came in 2003, and we discussed, accreditation, and the board wasn’t convinced they really wanted to do it. And so what we decided we would do is we would look at those categories. And we would spend our time identifying gaps, and then closing the gaps. So we did that for about six years, until finally we decided, gosh, if we’re going to put this much work into it, and you also have programs, if you don’t do them within two years, you really shouldn’t use them with some great programs, we need to go ahead and just put this together. And if we’re going to do it, then we need to make sure that we have everything in place to create a five star because you want the five stars, right? So we did that. And so everything that we shored up and the the gaps that we closed and the work that we did, later, really strong foundation. So my advice, and I think had we not had that foundation, it would not have positioned us then to have the data and the numbers and the programs in place. That allowed us then to not just qualify through the numbers, but then to actually, you know, be able to submit the application and be then chosen as a finalist. We also have and have been blessed with a lot of great, not just board chairs, but board members. So I remember when we interviewed back in 2013, I took one of my former board chairs with me to do the interview. And he was as knowledgeable about the organization almost as knowledgeable as I was, and had been integrally involved in a lot of our initiatives, that speaks highly when you have volunteers who are that immersed in the culture of the organization, that they understand it at the same level. So I guess my advice would be if you have the the systems and the processes, the foundation and the infrastructure, it will sustain you. And you can have a year where you maybe your results aren’t what you typically would have, or you have a rogue board member or you have a toxic staff member or whatever it may be. All those things will happen throughout a career of you know, many years. But that infrastructure and that stability that you’ve built, and those systems that have seen you through that is what will create the sustainability and allow you to grow to the next level. So I can actually track that to 2007 when I changed our work environment to be a little more entrepreneurial, and less restrictive, more encouraging of working outside, in the outside of the office if you can be more productive, and then our systems and processes and that’s when we started seeing the results. And then from there, you know, like you’ve read with the bio, we’ve been able to achieve the five stars since that first application in 2013, and then be able to qualify and compete, and then win back in 2015. And then be a finalist this year. So that’s my advice. It’s not sexy, but it is foundational, and it’s systems and processes and keep your eye on the ball and alignment would be my other piece of advice. And then use your data to drive your decisions. All of that. You wrap it up in a pretty little ball and put a bow on it. Yeah, like

Brandon Burton 34:41
you say it’s not sexy. But you had also mentioned before you don’t do anything that’s outside of your mission, right so you can have your systems and processes surrounded by your mission. That’s going to put you in the right course.

Candace Boothby 34:53
But we do like the wow factor. So I years ago I had a board member say to me, we have the state ache but where’s the sizzle in the aroma? So we always want to have the sizzle in the room. And the other thing is always be open to change, embrace change, just because you’ve done it, don’t keep doing it. So every year when we start looking at our program of work for the next year, we always push back throughout the year, we’re pushing back, is this still where it needs to be? Do we still need to do it? There have been many programs we’ve sunsetted. And that we have to that we’re reimagining right now to bring back. But I think that keeps it fresh. And that keeps people like me who like a challenge and change and energy that keeps me motivated as well.

Brandon Burton 35:36
Right? Absolutely. Well, Candace, I like asking everyone I have on the show, as we look to the future of chambers of commerce, how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward.

Candace Boothby 35:49
So if there are chambers out there that have not read the horizon initiative, I would strongly encourage them to do that. ACC is in the midst of revamping them. But I think all nine of those initiatives are important, I think at the root of it, though, is leadership, there’s one called catalytic leadership. And you can have great communications good technology, you can, you know, be very much aware of what’s happening in the community and what the issues are. But if you don’t have a leadership, that’s going to understand how you embrace that, and how you package it, and how you move it forward, then the rest of this stuff doesn’t really matter. So I think, for chambers to be relevant in the future, there just needs to be a constant attention being paid to building leaders, and it’s harder in today’s world, because people don’t have as much time, the role of leaders in the community is shifting a bit. And, you know, so you have to sometimes redefine who the leaders are, that the leader at the Chamber is the one that has to help keep the eye on the ball and keep that out, or in the forefront. And making sure that new leaders are being identified and brought in and put at the table. And, you know, it can be exhausting. But without the catalytic leadership mindset, you’re not really going to be able to, you know, engage the public or, you know, be aware of what’s happening internationally and be able to be successful in aligning your chamber with that. It takes leaders with ideas, and motivation and courage to be able to do those kinds of things. So that’s my little advice for the future. Love

Brandon Burton 37:39
it, and so much wisdom in that. Candace, is there any contact information you’d like to share for listeners who might want to reach out and connect with you and learn more about what setting you guys apart as a chamber, the year finalist? Sure, and

Candace Boothby 37:54
I’m always happy to share. I’ll share whatever resources we have happy to talk. So you can reach me at the NewnanCowetaChamber.org and my email is very simple. It’s just candace@newnancowetachamber.org.

Brandon Burton 38:10
That’s perfect. We will get that in our show notes for this episode, as well as a picture of the cover of your beautiful magazine and downtown square and courthouse for everybody to pull up and check out but Candace this has been great having you back on Chamber Chat Podcast. I wish you and your team best of luck in Dallas as chamber the year.

Candace Boothby 38:30
Thank you. It’s always a delight to see you and I guess we’ll see you there. Right. Absolutely. Okay. Well, thanks very much for having me. I appreciate it.

Brandon Burton 38:39
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Chambers Leveraging AI with Kaytee Lorentzen

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

Let’s hear from Becky Womble, President of the Bastrop Chamber to hear about her experience with Community Matters.

Becki Womble 1:03
I’ve been using Community Matters for probably six or seven years now. And in a previous life, I sold commercial printing so I can highly recommend Community Matters because it’s a complete turnkey job for any busy chamber exec and it’s a wonderful, beautiful printed product whenever you’re finished. And I just I’m very sold on Community Matters. And with a printing background I just big endorsement from me.

Brandon Burton 1:44
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Our guest for this episode is Kaytee Lorentzen. Kaytee is the Director of Communications and events at the Greater Bloomington Chamber of Commerce. She spearheads the Chamber’s multifaceted marketing communications initiative engaging with a diverse array of stakeholders including Chamber members, the public media board and staff members. Her role involves closely collaborating with every department to craft coherent and compelling communication and marketing materials that cater to their unique needs. Beyond communications, she meticulously organizes and oversees the myriad of events that the Chamber orchestrates ensuring that they align with the organization’s objectives and standards. Kaytee has been a part of the chamber team since May of 2021, initially as a marketing and communications coordinator before stepping into the role as marketing and communications manager in January 2023, and subsequently evolving into her current position in September 2023. Before joining the chamber as a staff member, she was a member of the chamber with her photography business for four years. Kaytee holds a bachelor’s degree in journalism with a concentration in photojournalism from Ball State University. She’s a graduate from the Indiana chamber Executives Association, who’s your chamber Academy in June 2022, and is currently pursuing a master’s degree at Purdue University. And Kaytee, I am very excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat Podcast. I would love to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the Chamber Champions that are out there listening and share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better.

Kaytee Lorentzen 3:37
Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much, Brandon, for having me on. I’ve been listening to your podcast ever since I have been a chamber professional. So I was super excited to get this opportunity. You helped me grow into this position. So I appreciate that. And everyone that’s been on the podcast as well. Just a little something interesting about myself. That isn’t in my bio. If I had a you know, a separate universe life, then I probably would have been a detective. I love true crime stuff. It’s kind of weird. Much I Love it. But even growing up I was, you know, doing forensics, trying to figure out fingerprinting and putting clues together. So that is what, but I would be in a different life. That’s

Brandon Burton 4:21
That is interesting. And there’s something to that the thrill of solving a mystery. You know, my my wife, she works at our kids elementary school. She’s the front desk receptionist and every now and then she’ll come home from work and say, I should have a detective badge. Like my GED today, you know, usually it’s some you know, kid in the neighborhood that’s caused some mischief, and they get caught on a ring doorbell camera or something. So the police will bring it to the school and say Do you recognize this kid? So she solves the mysteries. But there’s there’s something to that at the thrill of solving a mystery for sure. Oh,

Kaytee Lorentzen 4:55
yeah, like watching it on television shows I’m all about okay, I wonder if this happens. Next. Right,

Brandon Burton 5:01
right. Well tell us a little bit more about the greater Bloomington chamber just to give us an idea of the size staff scope of work. The tight you know, what kind of work you guys are involved with just to kind of set the table for our discussion. Yeah,

Kaytee Lorentzen 5:14
absolutely. So the greater Bloomington Chamber of Commerce is located in Bloomington, Indiana. We are the home of Indiana University. So go Hoosiers, which is very ironic considering I go to Purdue University for graduate education. We Are Rivals so that’s really fun to be a part of. But the greater Bloomington Chamber of Commerce, we have six full time staff members and one part time staff. And all ton of interns. Currently we have one high school intern to undergrad scholar intern. So they’ll be with us for all four of their undergrad years, and two grad fellows which are also going to be with us for their whole grad program. So that’s how many we have a ton of people here. And we have about 850 members currently, Bloomington itself, the size is about 80,000 people. And then Monroe County, which is the county that Bloomington resides in is about 140,000 we say we are the greater Bloomington So yes, we do have a lot of Bloomington businesses but also more Monroe County and surrounding.

Brandon Burton 6:25
Very good that that definitely helps to give some perspective and even going through your bio just in the marketing communications as you’ve had different roles, shows you guys are you’ve got to you’ve got a good amount of staff and get a good team there to work with. So that’s awesome. Well, our topic that we’ve settled on for today is very relevant and timely for all the buzz that’s going around right now around chat GPT and AI and generative AI and so we’re gonna dive in deeper in that discussion today. Katie has done some some great presentations on this at different conferences. So we’re going to kind of tap into her her wealth of knowledge to be able to share some of that, with all you chamber pros as we as we move forward in this conversation. We’ll dive into that as soon as they get back from this quick break.

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Donna Novitsky 9:03
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Brandon Burton 9:57
All right, Kaytee, we are back And so I’m excited to learn how you’re using generative AI and just AI in general, as a chamber professional, where you see the use cases and where it’s helped to save you time make your job easier. And does it save you time at this point? You know, or is it just the learning and everything, but it ends up making your job easier. I’d love just to hear how you’re integrating this. And hopefully spark some ideas for listeners maybe want to explore some of these aspects of utilizing AI at their chamber.

Kaytee Lorentzen 10:32
Absolutely. So first and foremost, like artificial intelligence is just this plethora of things. So it pretty much all ultimately is intended to make computers do things that when done by people are described as having indicated intelligence. So I was very skeptical at first, I’m not one of those people who typically jump on bandwagons. So in November of last year, or sorry, to it would be November 2022. At that point, when it came out, I was like, I don’t know about this chat. GBT, it kind of seems a little not in my realm. Then I tried it. All I did was just asked a few questions. And I was like, wow, I just opened the door to something that’s going to make my life so much easier, just by asking it simple questions. And the more I’ve been using it, the more I have learned how to write the prompts that are necessary for it to generate the kind of answers that I’m meeting. So for example, the one thing I use it a lot for is just rewriting a lot of our website copy. It sounds very dated, and some of its not customer focused. And that’s more of what it needs to be. You want it to say, like I asked it, this is what we currently have on our website for our membership benefits. Can you rewrite this in more of a customer focused realm or point of view, and also give some examples of why it’s important for somebody to join the Chamber of Commerce. And they will give you a full list like, a lot of the time, if you ask it for list, it’ll give it to you. And now that I’ve used it so much, it thinks that I like list all the time. So it will continuously give me list until I say please stop putting into the list. I just need a paragraph. Yeah. And then it typically apologizes. It goes, Oh, I’m so sorry. Let me fix that for you. Right, right. The big thing that I’m doing right now is just rewriting a lot of our website copy. I’ve also used it for social media copy. I’ve even asked it to create social, like a social media plan. Small Business Week was something I was like, Okay, I want to do something different. I don’t just want to say, yeah, it’s Small Business Week, let’s celebrate small business. Let’s actually make some sort of content with it. And so it was able to give me five different days of social media content that all I had to do was just pretty much copy and paste and find some graphics and photos to go with it. Yeah.

Brandon Burton 12:59
So talk to us a little bit more about rewriting the website copy. Are you literally are you copy and pasting paragraphs from your website, login in chat? GPT? Are you able to give a link to the website and say, scan this page? And tell me how how does that interface work for those listening?

Kaytee Lorentzen 13:15
Yeah, it depends on what program you’re using, and what version of the program you’re using. I know, some websites will do that. But not all of them, like I primarily use to actually btw and chat GPT for. So I use the paid version. But I don’t put a link in there. I literally copy and paste the exact information so that way I like because a lot of our content is pretty long website page. So I just was like, No, I just want this section rewritten in this point of view, and then obviously, the main thing is, I always say, double check, it’s work. Because you never know what is gonna pop out and you want to edit it. I don’t ever think that you should copy and paste directly from whatever chat GBT or you know, whatever generative AI system you’re using, you need to go in and, like have oversight, it gets you 80% of the way there. But you need to go in and edit and finesse it and make it more your voice.

Brandon Burton 14:16
Yes, so you shared your experience in November of 20 I guess it’s 2022 right when chat GPT was made public and available for everybody to use. And I remember going to Thanksgiving dinner my brother in law was like Oh, you gotta check this out. And he’s he’s a very loud in your face kind of person anyway, so he’s shoving his phone everybody’s facing you ask it a question and just very excited about it and like, Okay, calm down. You know, so I asked him a few questions and and really the responses I got back because I was asking business related questions. You know, how can I create a social media posts from my podcast or tell me about a chamber of commerce, like what Chambers of Commerce do and just that feedback I was getting from it initially. You needed to verify, you know, the stuff it was kicking out. And granted, this is Chad GBT three. So it wasn’t it hadn’t scanned, you know nearly as much of the of the web and things like that. But an example of just this last week, I’ve got a daughter in fifth grade, she came home with a math problem in her homework that she wasn’t able to figure out. And my, I think it was my son who’s a senior single as chat GPT. And, like, first of all, it seems like cheating or, and then your homework to plug it in. But like, we worked through the problem, got the answer? And then I’m like, I’m gonna try this, you know. So I asked chat GBT exactly how the question was on the homework. And immediately it spit back an answer. And it wasn’t the right answer. So I gave it some clarifying, you know, prompts along with it, then it apologize, spit back and other answer, and it never came up with the right answer. And after verifying, like more and more of the criteria with it, it kept apologizing, but then we kept giving me the same answer over and over. And like, okay, and this is still catch up three GPT 3.5. So it wasn’t the paid version, maybe that would have gotten me better results, but goes to the point of you need to verify you can’t just trust everything that it puts out as being doctrine, like you got to, you got to really read it, you got to make sure it’s accurate. And some may say, Well, does that really save you time then? So how would you approach that with if you need to verify everything? How does that aspect work and time saving, or you know, the application into real world scenarios?

Kaytee Lorentzen 16:36
I think it varies on what you’re planning on using chat GPT for so if you’re using it for research, that can definitely still take you some more time, it hasn’t been able to scan everything, and it’s still learning, it’s still, you know, it’s still a child, and it’s learning new tech. Yeah, it’s still a baby, it’s still trying to figure out what it’s doing. But for me, I use it more for things that I know are fact based, like hard numbers type of thing. I use it more for like the colorful language. For an example, there was one way someone emailed us and I was trying to explain to them, I don’t think you understood what I was trying to say. But also saying it in a much better way. Because right, there are some times where your brain just you know, when that clicker icon just keeps going on a blink word screen. That’s how I felt with this. I was like, I don’t know how to say this. So I just asked chat GPT. And it gave me a much better way of writing it. That actually was exactly what I wanted to say. But I just didn’t have the words or the sound mind at that point. I think it was like 430 on a Friday or something. And it put it all together and flowed nicely. So that was something I more use it for is earliest for chatty BTW I use it more for that aspect. Even if you asked it to give you a source, sometimes it makes it up. So but at least if you can look up and see if that source even exists. And that sometimes works. I think I’ve only used it a few times with statistics. And then what I’ll do is I’ll just copy and paste this statistic that it gives me and look up where it is in Google. Yeah, just to verify, make sure that’s fine. But yeah, it varies, because I’ve also heard similar situations with homework, where someone it was I think it was NPR that I was listening to. And they were saying, Well, my daughter was doing homework. And they and I’m a history major. And it asked if this particular person in history was pro separation of church and state or against it, and it gave the wrong answer. And they were like, That’s not right. So I if you ever ask it fact, based information like that, then I would at least just copy and paste what it gave you and ask it as much question as you can to get where they got it from, quote unquote. And then you can find it on the internet pretty quickly. So

Brandon Burton 19:10
is there a value to giving it feedback to say that’s not a correct answer? Or yes, I’m gonna challenge the answer a little.

Kaytee Lorentzen 19:18
I think so because it’s learning based off of what you are giving it as well. So like if you there’s even after every single prompts that it gives you, was this, what you were looking for? Was this not and then there’s a thumbs up, thumbs down and you just put that in there it actually is teaching it. That’s another way that it’s learning on giving the correct answers. So if other people start asking similar questions or something like that, it’s it’s now learning based off of our responses, right, right.

Brandon Burton 19:49
And I think you know, although some of the information you get may not be totally accurate need to verify if you’re having some writer’s block going on or looking for ideas Just to be able to put a prompt in and receive, you know, a ton of ideas and, you know, pretty much instantaneously, things that will get those creative juices going in your mind, again, that I’ve heard it said that it’s not to replace your own thinking in your own mind, but it’s to supplement it’s to add to what you’re already doing. Yes. Yeah. I know, in an example that I had, there was a chamber professional that I mentioned, how much they enjoy the podcast, and you know, very nice email about what they have appreciated. So this is great. Would you mind putting this as a review on Apple podcasts? And they try it and try it couldn’t figure it out? Like, can you tell me how to leave a review? Like, let me ask Chet GPT. So I just did, how do you leave a review for by and just copy and paste it? And I could have typed the response and said, Here’s how you do it. But to look up each, you know, the website and give a link and here and there and back and forth? Just that plug it in chat? GPT it was all right, copy, paste, send and it was done. And it was easy. It was easy.

Kaytee Lorentzen 21:05
Yeah, as long as you just review it and be like, Yeah, that’s exactly how you do it, then you can just copy and paste, which is nice. And that’s kind of what I’ve done. Even for scripts for videos that we do. I’ve asked it to make it you can even ask it. Can you make this more of a TED Talk style, and it will completely read rewrite it? I did that actually the first time I presented this at the Indiana chamber Executives Association Conference. Hi, how do you write my intro? I didn’t like how it was like, have a we tried TED Talk style? Yeah, very different. It was, it almost felt like when you were reading it out loud, exactly how it starts. Right. Any TED Talk? So

Brandon Burton 21:50
maybe let’s talk about that a little bit about the prompts that we put into to any AI, generative AI assistant. What kind of things do we need to consider? Because I think we’re very much a lot of the public is very much still in the mindset of Google, right? You put in? What is this? He put in a question, get a response. So talk to us about a prompt, and maybe becoming a prompt engineer, so to speak.

Kaytee Lorentzen 22:17
Yes, yes. So that is something I’ve definitely been trying to hone my skills on, is learning how to create the best prompts. I always say, garbage in, garbage out. So whatever. If you give it like subpar information, it’s going to give you a subpar answer. So you want to make sure that it has as much information as you can possibly give it. Like if you’re trying to make a all do something pretty simple, like a social media post, if you tell it your audience exactly who it’s supposed to cater to, you can even tell it more of like your customer persona, it will give you a much better answer and a less generic answer, it’ll become more personalized. So that’s a lot of the time why I copy and paste a lot of our content when I’m asking it to rewrite it. So I say take this and move it to something more like this other thing. So that could be you know, saying it needs it needs to have more colorful language, can you make it sound more professional, this needs to be more towards small business owner, not necessarily the big business, so you can change up exactly what you’re wanting it to do. But the more specific the better it is.

Brandon Burton 23:37
Yeah. So as you’re given that response reminds me I had recently read a book called The AI whispers method. And it it’s a, it’s an AI generative fiction novel. So it takes the whole hero storyline and plugs it into to teach you how to use AI. And it talks a lot about generating prompts. And even asking, like, for example, with Chet GPT, to act as a math teacher or act as a math professor to give me an answer to this problem or act as a sports historian and tell me why, you know, this scenario is happening or so being able to get that context of act as if or act as a different, you know, expert in different fields, it’s able to tap into different resources and really understand what it is that you’re looking for. So as I played around with that there’s a lot of power in the act as prompt when you plug that into chat. GPT

Kaytee Lorentzen 24:45
Absolutely. That’s actually something I do for our customer journey type of thing. I said to chat GPT act as if you are a brand new business. You’ve never heard of the Chamber of Commerce. You We are interested in it because someone mentioned that it’s a great thing to join, why should they join? What are their pain points? What are their objectives? What are the rebuttals to those objectives? So you can really start tailoring your content to better address their pain points and why you’re the solution to their problems.

Brandon Burton 25:19
Right. I love that. So let’s, let’s maybe circle back a little bit more to the generative AI. Discussion. So you mentioned you, you’ve used it to rewrite website content, you use it for social media posts. What other applications are you seeing in the chamber world, specifically for using generative AI? That

Kaytee Lorentzen 25:40
is a fabulous question. So for me, I have been using it more obviously, for the marketing aspect of it. I’ve even asked it to write event descriptions. So what makes people come into the event more? What makes it more appealing, besides just saying, you know, come to this chamber event at this day, on this time at this place, we look forward to expanding your network hope to see you there. It sounds the exact same every single time. So how do I change it up and make it sound more exciting? What makes that chamber member have to be at that event. So I use that a lot for to change up the descriptions. I’ve also asked it to make correct like full social media campaigns, not just the captions itself. Also, like I mentioned earlier, the market research different emails to members. So like how, like, if you’re saying I want people to fill out this survey, what makes someone fill out this, if you ask to attribute it, right, this email, enticing people to fill out this survey that doesn’t. Obviously, we’re all nonprofits, we don’t have a whole lot of money to give out as an incentive. So without incentives, I’m creating different types of plans for customer journeys. The one that I’ve used the most often is writing up ours, we have a sponsorship book that we do all at one time, kind of like why GM does. And so I’ve asked it to rewrite our sponsorship book and why people should sponsor it and why it’s important to sponsor it. And then lately, I have noticed AI disclosures on your website, writing a disclaimer for your website, we actually didn’t have quite a few like the privacy policies, those things that you’re supposed to have on your website. And so I was like, I’m gonna see if Chad GPD can come up with something very like simple and then obviously run it by our lawyer, just to make sure everything sounds great. But it really helps take out a lot of the guesswork for us. We didn’t have to do you know, how many hours of research trying to make sure that what we had in there? Would it be? Sound for us to use, even if it’s just like a blanket one? I think ours is our AI disclaimer is probably two paragraphs, just saying, you know, we use AI, there are things that may be generated by AI that come out here, but there’s always human oversight, ultimately, is what it says but in some more legalese term. Yeah.

Brandon Burton 28:15
Like that. So I guess that brings up a good talk at a good point to talk about as well, where I know I’ve been at chamber conferences and breakout sessions you you lead some these breakout sessions, where we talk about AI? And the question always comes up as far as the legality, the copyright issues if you’re especially like image generation, right? So if you’re asking generative AI to produce an image for you, who owns the rights to that, is there copyright issues if you’re bringing in certain elements into that? So if you would speak a little bit to the legality and regulations around AI and what we need to kind of be aware of and kind of look out for as we kind of navigate through this new world of artificial intelligence?

Kaytee Lorentzen 29:03
Absolutely. This is definitely something we need. As chamber professionals. If you’re using AI just to keep up to date on there are quite a few websites that you can track legislation. And there’s a lot on AI. Currently, right now, as of August 30, of 2023, the US Copyright Office issued a notice of inquiry in the Federal Register on copyright. And AR pretty much just means they’re going to be studying it to see kind of whether legislation or regulatory steps are even warranted, and also just steps to advise Congress on any legislation that does come through. But anything right now made by something other than human is not protected by copyright. So if I like the API disclosure I was talking about I can’t if someone else wanted to copy and paste it and use it, they legally can. And I can’t cry that that’s copyright. So that’s it. One thing that we have to look at, right now a lot of people are getting frustrated with the image portion of it, I haven’t used that aspect too much, because I still feel like there is a lot of stock photo that I can use in that aspect. And I don’t need to just create an image that we don’t have. But other people are saying that it’s very unfair to the artists, which I do, as someone who’s a photographer, I get that completely. And it takes, you know, scanning my work to use someone else’s yet that’s not exactly something I’m a fan of. But I am interested to see where that’s going to be going and legislations and any what Congress is planning on doing on that. And I do think that they’re in a very interesting position right now. And I think they do need to take that whole issue very seriously, that AI is here, and it’s going to, it’s, you know, people are still scared of it. But it was very similar to like, when the internet happened, it, everyone was scared of it, it was this big thing that everyone’s like, this is going to change the world. It did. But now if we look back, if you don’t have a website, you’re not really relevant. Or you’re not considered trustworthy. So if that’s something similar what AI is gonna do, that’s, I’m just very interested to see where it’s gonna go, what regulations we’re gonna have. So just keeping up to date, making sure that we are using it legally, then that is something that we do need to do, and do our due diligence on it, as you know, people that are in the community seen as a trustworthy and leader.

Brandon Burton 31:42
Yeah, for sure. Now, it’s definitely important to keep that on the forefront with any legislation that comes out. But I think to your point with the internet, you know, if you didn’t adopt the internet and have a website, now, you’re kind of irrelevant. And I see a very similar course with AI. And just the AI technology has been adopted quicker than any other technology in the history of mankind. I don’t know, besides like the fire, maybe I don’t know. But. But as far as the technology goes, it’s been adopted very quickly. And I could easily see in five or 10 years maybe doesn’t even take that long, that there’s going to be two types of chambers, right? There’s going to be the ones that use AI and the ones that are no longer around, essentially, because they’re not relevant. And they’re not able to really leverage the power that comes from Ai, especially when you’re dealing with limited budgets, and being nonprofits and all that. There’s a lot of leverage. Yeah,

Kaytee Lorentzen 32:38
and I completely understand why it would seem intimidating or scary at first, because I was in that same exact boat. But as soon as I tried it, I was very surprised at the fact that I felt like it was something that anyone and everyone can use. Even if you’re just asking simple questions like, can you give me a recipe for a very simple meal like something, it’s something you can just play around with and have fun. And the more you use it, the more you find things that you can use it for? Yeah,

Brandon Burton 33:09
I’ve heard people will take, you know, just random ingredients they have in the refrigerator and say I’ve got these seven ingredients, give me a recipe of something, I can make it it’ll do it. So where would you suggest somebody gets started with a journey in AI and just kind of getting their mind wrapped around it? Yeah,

Kaytee Lorentzen 33:28
I would say just pick up like one or any of the generative AI tools that we have available. Google’s version is Bard. And then there’s chat GPT. There’s all just, obviously, Google, because Google or cert, go in your search engine, and ask it for a generative AI tool, and just start asking it questions. And the more you do it, the more you’ll get better at asking the I don’t want to write questions, but better questions, you refine the questions, you refine the questions to get the answers that you’re looking for. And then you start, that’s when your wheels start turning and figuring out where can I apply this in my professional life? Right.

Brandon Burton 34:10
So I didn’t give you a heads up that I was going to ask you this question. So if we need to edit it out, we can but I’m curious. What are you excited about on the forefront that you see coming with AI in the next weeks, months years?

Kaytee Lorentzen 34:24
I’m just excited to see the evolution of where it’s going. It just reminds me of like when the first iPhone came out, like and just seeing how it evolves and where it’s at now that it’s pretty much a part of our daily lives. If you’re an Apple user, obviously. It’s something that I am just excited to see where it’s gonna go. I’m excited to see how our legislation will take this and you hopefully use it for the good obviously, there’s always some bad actors, but I think Oh, For all this is going to be something that’s extremely well received in, in our world. Right?

Brandon Burton 35:07
I think there’s just a world of opportunity available. And quite honestly, I don’t know if legislation can keep up with the trends and the way things will develop. But we need to be plugged in and not be burying our head in the sand pretending like it’ll go away because it’s not going to go away. Well, Katie, as we look to the future, actually, let me back up before I ask that question for a chamber who’s listening who wants to take their chamber up to the next level, what kind of tip or action item might you share for them to try to accomplish that goal?

Kaytee Lorentzen 35:42
I would say, the tip to use is embrace playing. I know that sounds so weird, but embrace that it’s something new embrace change, it will make a world of a difference. Because I can even tell you even in my office, as soon as people started embracing this tool, it was a game changer. Like our membership director, she now uses that a lot to help personalize each individual sales email, instead of just having like this copy and paste mentality of the same type of email, she can personalize it a lot more saying, this is the industry this person is in. And now she says that she really can’t go without it. Our operations manager uses it to help create some Excel documents, like it’s different things, the more you play with it, and embrace the change that it can bring, the better I think we’ll all be.

Brandon Burton 36:41
Absolutely, it reminds me. Last year, our church, we were putting together a fundraiser for our youth program at church. And I was trying to get the text together for the flyers that we’re gonna go out and promote on social media and everything. And I was just having the hardest time trying to make all the words fit on this flyer without being crowded and like telling what we’re trying to accomplish. And I told my wife, this Super Chat GPT will say I plug it in, give it the prompts, and it spit back and answer those beautiful, perfect, and we use that going forward. Like if I would have just done that from the beginning, it would have saved me so much time and headache and just beating my head against a wall trying to figure something out. That wasn’t coming to me. And it was it’s a great tool. So I would encourage everybody to embrace the play and embrace the change. Because I think initially, you and I both had this similar initial reactions I get I’ll know about this chat GPT steps, the more you get into it, you see more and more applications where it can assist you and make your life a little bit easier. So as we look to the future of chambers of commerce, how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?

Kaytee Lorentzen 37:53
You know, it’s funny as I was like, you know, how do I answer? Because I knew this one was coming, right? Because I hear from everyone. So I asked chat GPT what they thought. And it gave me a gave me a list of nine different things. But I would like to kind of summarize what because a lot of it is things that I thought of but I was like how do I make this sound? Great. I do see a lot of the future of chambers using innovation and technology adaptation, obviously, for me using AI and GPT. I do see that. And I think with that we will become leaders in the business space in general. I think it will bring forward I’m trying to think of the correct word that I want to use. But it will bring forward this leadership of how the standard should be set on business and how they can embrace it as well. And I think that we’ll have a lot of Gosh, I’m trying to figure out

Brandon Burton 39:04
here, but you can plug it as chat GPT

Kaytee Lorentzen 39:09
Pretty much yeah, just focusing on the technological changes focusing on small business and it’s going to just help leverage that and just, you know, promote this business atmosphere that I think will be that will occur encourage all of that.

Brandon Burton 39:33
Yeah, I can definitely see that and we need to be embrace the innovation that comes with technology. Yes.

Kaytee Lorentzen 39:43
You pretty much said exactly what I was wanting to say. All

Brandon Burton 39:45
right, well, whether you know it or not, you said it at some point in there because I wrote it down and he said well, Katie, I want to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for listeners who want to reach out and learn more, maybe Do you see some of the slides or anything you’ve shared at different conferences or whatever you’re willing to share and help out with them? What would be the best way for someone to reach out and connect?

Kaytee Lorentzen 40:09
The best way is probably through either email or through LinkedIn. So my email is just klorentzen@chamberbloomington.org. And my LinkedIn, you can just find me, Katie Lorentzen, and I spell it differently. So I’ll spell it here for you guys. It is Kaytee and then my last name Lorentzen. And either a message on either of those are typically the best way to get a hold of me just because I am all over the place. And my phone is always on me. So those two apps right there for me.

Brandon Burton 40:45
That’s perfect. And we’ll get that in our show notes too. So people can pull that up and have easy access to reach out. But I appreciate all the value you offered to listeners today here on chamber tap podcast for sharing your experience of exploring and being innovative using generative AI and I just, you know, it’ll be fun to look back at this episode a year from now and be like, Wow, things have really advanced in the last year. So I know I’m excited. Yeah, but thank you for being with us today. This has been a fun and enlightening conversation. So thank you.

Kaytee Lorentzen 41:18
Thank you for having me.

Brandon Burton 41:19
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Data & Technology with Jaime di Paulo

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

Let’s hear from Becky Womble, President of the Bastrop Chamber to hear about her experience with Community Matters.

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Our guest for this episode is Jaime de Paulo. Jaime is President and CEO of the Illinois Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, a prominent organization dedicated to networking advocating for and developing the Hispanic business community in the Midwest. Since assuming leadership and 2019. Jaime has spearheaded numerous initiatives and collaborations positioning ahcc as a finalist in the 13th world chambers Congress, the largest economic forum for chambers and businesses worldwide. Jaime’s exceptional exceptional leadership and contributions have garnered recognition and accolades. He became a distinguished member of the Economic Club of Chicago and infinite influential organization connecting leaders in Chicago’s economic circles. The government of Mexico officially acknowledged him as one of the most influential Mexican Americans in the Midwest, highlighting his significance with the region’s economic landscape. Moreover, he received the 2022 American Mexican Association’s Leader of the Year Award, which celebrates his dedication to the community and his role within the broader Latino community. Driven by his commitment to empowering Latino entrepreneurs, Jaime has worked to strengthen the Latin X incubator program in collaboration with 1871, a renowned business incubator. This initiative supports young Hispanic tech companies, fostering innovation and providing them with opportunities to secure capital funds. Outside of his professional pursuits, Jaime is married and is a proud father of three sons and a daughter. Hi, man, I’m excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat Podcast, I’d love to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the Chamber Champions that are listening and share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better. Well,

Jaime di Paulo 4:01
thank you, Brandon. I want to thank you first for inviting me to this wonderful chat and thanks to the listeners because we are out there doing the good work or that empowers more businesses. And, you know, feel proud of what we do. I mean, I would just sharing with you that the Our job is very significant, and it means a lot to small businesses. So kudos to all my chamber colleagues out there listening. You know, I was born in while I had I Mexico, I grew up in the United States. My father was American. And you know, when I was when I went to high school, I went back to Mexico, and I became a DJ. I was a renowned DJ back in the late 80s in that club in Acapulco called the baby oh, so some of you have been there some of you have not but if you compare it the baby oh, it was the comparison to studio 51 in New York City and next. So it’s a it was a big Back in the day, so you know, I lost my hair since then. But anyway,

Brandon Burton 5:05
that is awesome. I love getting these these fun facts about people and never would have guessed it. But that’s a, that is a great fact about you. So thank you. Well, tell us a little bit about the Illinois Hispanic Chamber, size of the chamber scope of work, kind of airy cover staff, that sort of thing. Just to kind of set the table for our discussion.

Jaime di Paulo 5:29
We one of the bigger chambers around we have 19 staff members, and we’re about to hire eight more we just announced last week. So we just, you know, we do a lot of government contracting. Our main focus is making sure minority owned companies have access to government contracting, because we see that as the future of our companies to scale. So that’s the reason why we are a bigger chamber than the norm. We have for example, we have an SBDC. In our Office of Small Business Development Center, we have what is called a PTAC. It’s not it’s called Apex which is a Procurement Technical Assistance Center, which helps minority owned companies get certifications so that so they can access government contracting. We contract with the United States Department of Transportation, for example, we in Region eight with we represent six states we help minority owned companies access us do T contracts, including water and airports and, and you know, and highways and all that. And then we also have a big contract with the Illinois Tollway, which is the, the you know, the Tollway authority here in this in the city of Chicago in the state of Illinois. So we make sure minority owned companies get hired and started working for them to scale this company. So we are a little bit bigger than a normal chamber. We have all these programs in between that’s why we bigger we our budget is about five and a half million dollars a year including that one and a half million dollar grant thing that just got to the beginning of next year. So we are growing certainly, since I started with a seven employees now we are you know 19 plus a couple full times 27

Brandon Burton 7:09
Yeah, I was seven so we put a big. Wow. Yeah, you guys are rockin and rollin and get your work cut out for you. That’s That’s awesome. I love it. So personally, I’m excited to get into our topic for discussion today. And as we kind of went back and forth a little bit we focused on the the areas of data and technology. And I know those are kind of hot topics for individuals and chambers at this time, especially with the emergence of AI and you know all sorts of things in that realm. But we will dive in much deeper into this conversation as soon as they get back from this quick break.

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Donna Novitsky 10:09
Hey there, Donna Novitsky, CEO of Yiftee here, and we are all about the shop local movement. We’re working with more than 500 communities like yours and 15,000 small businesses like your members. We’re big fans of Brandon and his Chamber Chat Podcast, so we’re helping to sponsor the show. But while I’ve got you here, what’s a Yiftee? You ask? It’s a digital gift card branded for your chamber that people spend only at the local shops that you authorize. In 2022 we drove 10’s of millions of dollars to small businesses in the US. The program is free for chambers and free for your local shops. You can sign up for a live zoom demo with me or one of my teammates yiftee.com/demo or email sales@yiftee.com. That’s why Yiftee.com. That’s it for now back to the show.

Brandon Burton 11:07
All right. Hi, me, we’re back. As I mentioned before the break, we’re focusing our discussion today around data and technology. And I know as a chamber, it’s super important to be able to make data driven decisions, right as we go about, you know, working in our organizations and knowing what the course of action to take on different things. But I’d love to know how you guys are implementing data and technology. And I know they’re related, but also kind of separate at the same time. So feel free to just take us whatever direction you’d like there and and we’ll we’ll go down that path. Certainly,

Jaime di Paulo 11:42
we belong to a small niche group called the Aspen Institute that help us download data. I was in New York City last week with the McKenzie group, and they just released new data on the state of Latinos in the in the United States. So everything we do is related to that particular data. So we got to make sure we have a significant impact on that data. For example, when this when the SBA talks about small businesses, they’re talking about 500 employees or less is a quick fact that in nationally, Hispanic or Latino businesses are under 20 employees. So when the SBA talks about small businesses, we’re not I believe, we’re not even on the picture, because we’re so small, so Chambers of Commerce just becomes very, very relevant to help those businesses scale, right. So everything we do, every program that we implement, everything we do is related to data, we and then in the technology side, we are fortunate enough to have our our offices at 1871. If you Google 1871, you’re going to see is the one of the number one or two incubators for technology in the world for businesses. So our office is right there. And the where the technology is made with it, technology happens. And we believe in technology. And we also believe that minorities should have an opportunity to develop new technologies, new applications, or whatever are solutions, and have the venture capital injected into those companies. And because we are offices there at 1871, we’ve been able to move that up a little bit. For example, 90% of new technology companies a surface every day in the world are Hispanic owned, but what percent of those Hispanic owned 90% Get get capital injected to it. So there’s a big disparity. And so our job here is to make sure the venture capital gets injected into minority owned companies awesome. We realize the data for example, we created a policy institute in our chamber. And we figured out how to create a scorecard using artificial intelligence. And in because of our 30 years in business that we have, we have a lot of data. We actually know what a procurement means and everything in between. So every bill that comes to the state of Illinois, we track and then we can create a scorecard for our legislative elected officials. So now we know who’s our big champion and who is and who we got to work with AI in terms of legislation stuff, using artificial intelligence, web scraping and all these other tools and utilizing the same model. We match it into contracts, for example. Right, so now you’ve seen we create a program called Kodama, you mentioned I was in Geneva and the world in the world Chambers of Commerce symposium and this past summer and because of that particular program that week, that particular solution that we curated is called Kodama contract radar Maximizer, which basically it matches contracts with capability statements in seconds. You know, when I mentioned we 20 employees or less we are busy working, we don’t have the staff or the knowledge to go search for contracts or government contracts, right. So This tool is going to revolutionize how people, you know, access those contracts because now you have everything on your hand, you just give me your capability statement or match it with the technology. And we’ll put in front of you contracts. So you basically qualify for it. In seconds. We are testing it right now, we did a couple of pilot programs in Lake County in the northern Chicago, we working with the City of Chicago to disclose our spending money. So now we know what kind of bunch contracts are happening. So we gonna be able to match him with companies. So we are about to launch a nationally and this thing is going to be an incredible tool tool for me chamber to use to help their

Brandon Burton 15:38
whims. That’s awesome. He said, It’s called Kurama.

Jaime di Paulo 15:41
What am I CLR AMA, contract radar maximize your website is there.

Brandon Burton 15:51
So let’s hone in on that a little bit more. I mean, I’m just full of excitement as I hear you talk about that and match in the contracts. And so when you have a chamber member, what would their experience be? Like, you know, applying karama? How would they access it how what what information they put in to get that instantaneous, almost feedback.

Jaime di Paulo 16:13
For example, if you, I’m sure everybody has heard of the government, federal government, they have what it’s called next codes, right? Every every, for example, you in construction, there’s a special number they gave you. So when you search for contracts, you use that particular code to identify yourself as a construction or, or cement or brick layer, or landscaper, or whatever it may be. So now utilizing that code and web scraping stuff analysis, or vectrus was called vectorize, which something I don’t understand, but my team does

Brandon Burton 16:51
have a team. Yeah, young people that

Jaime di Paulo 16:53
do the technology, we’re now able to if you put everything in like a company comes to us, we teach them how to do a capability statement, which is basically a one pager of who you are in one piece of paper and that particular. So it has different codes and different keywords that we can run into the system we came up with in the system will will search and will spit out the contracts you actually qualify for according to what you told us who you are as a company. Okay.

Brandon Burton 17:24
And then as far as going after those contracts, you guys provide any kind of support to help them figure out how to do that. And you had mentioned that earlier helping them get contracts? Yeah, how’s that process? Look,

Jaime di Paulo 17:38
we have what is called a PTAC, Procurement Technical Assistance Center that actually helps you have staff that will take you by the hand and show you how to apply. We’re working on technology right? Now this is going to actually self populate the application at what point the what you told us, so it’s coming. I mean, we a little bit step below that. But you know, a year or so we’re gonna have that on hand. So what I’m envisioning in nobody here, you’re gonna be able to fill out 80% of the application automatically. So yeah, finances and you know, that kind of stuff. But that’s something we, you know, you got to work with you on accountants.

Brandon Burton 18:17
So what kind of advantages do you see for your members in utilizing this type of technology and these tools that you’re making available for them?

Jaime di Paulo 18:28
Well, you know, when you go to even the playing field, for example, you know, that these huge companies out there, they have personality, all they do a search for contracts, now, we’re going to have the necessary tools for zero small companies have access to those contracts. So we’re going to revolutionize how the United States does government contracting, for example, right? So if you are a minority, like Hispanic, African American women, veteran or Asian, you are considered a minority in the United States. And so those are the guys who try to push so they can even they play? Yeah,

Brandon Burton 19:03
I’m glad that you said that that way, even in the the playing field. So I think that’s what AI that’s what it does, you know, a lot of people have the concept of AI is for the big companies are the ones that have the budget and understand how to use it and all that. But really, AI is going to level the playing field across so many different platforms. That I’m glad that that’s the vision is it levels, the playing field and brings your members up to a competitive level across the nation.

Jaime di Paulo 19:30
You know, AI can be a scary thing, but it can be used properly. It’s a wonderful tool, and nothing we use in it properly. Right? So who knows what AI is going to take us in the future. But at the end of the day, we need to take advantage of those tools and use it to the event to to scale our companies, right?

Brandon Burton 19:48
Yeah. So do you have somebody internally that’s working on the technology with the AI to develop these these platforms, or do you consult with somebody or how’s this being developed? So, within your chamber,

Jaime di Paulo 20:01
we actually have to two engineers, you know, just coding full time and the director of the program. Wow.

Brandon Burton 20:11
So not everybody has that on their staff. But where would somebody get started, you know, maybe a local chamber, you’re wanting to implement some of these things? How would you suggest they get started,

Jaime di Paulo 20:24
we, we don’t we still working on the model, we don’t know how we’re going to do it, we license it or just give it away, or we got to make a little money on it. But our intent is to bring up our companies and across the United States, we’ve been in conversation with Walmart, for example, you know, in government contracting, every contract is public information. Private is not so having this tool, access private corporations, like for example, Walmart, Target and Home Depot, whoever it is, we need to create partnerships directly with those companies. So we will talk into Walmart and the Google and some other companies so they can have access to this to this tool. So they can do some hiring. But it’s gonna that’s gonna be a little bit more difficult, because it’s not public information, those contracts. So yeah, work to be done.

Brandon Burton 21:18
Gotta get them to play along with you, right? That’s right. So the the technology incubator, I’d like to maybe hear some of the things that you’ve seen, you know, birthed out of that incubator there. I get excited here and about this technology programs, and you know, what people are into and what’s kind of cutting edge, but what are what are some of these things that you’ve seen come out of there? No,

Jaime di Paulo 21:45
it’s amazing what goes through our, our offices there, we got companies, for example, we have a Latina woman, micro cycle is her company, she she basically figured out that I mushroom eats concrete, how I have, but she’s been taking marketing that technology, and it’s a solution for the landfills, for example. Right? So she’s been scaling at a pace you have never seen, right? We have a company that, you know, that connect hero, it’s using utilizing technology in the retirement homes, and connecting them with families. It’s an amazing thing. And these two companies, for example, they’re they’re growing big time. And those are companies that we helped start, you know, so it’s, and we have, you know, work, we just graduated a cohort of 25 companies last week. So, you know, we have about 400 companies we’ve worked with, and 80% of them are still still in business trying to get that capital so they can scale up. So some of those, like, cycling clinic here on it, and a few others are beyond that, right. So it’s very cool. Spot hero, for example, I don’t know if you heard of that, that came out of the incubator. It’s not a Hispanic guy, but it came out of the incubator, I had an opportunity to meet him, it’s a tool you use for to find a parking space, low costs around, okay, Spot hero, so, so as many companies like that,

Brandon Burton 23:21
I like it, I like hearing these these different ideas. And it’s got to be a sense of pride, seeing these people come with an idea and watching it grow and watching them be successful and looking for that additional funding to continue, you know, adding fuel to the fire, so to speak.

Jaime di Paulo 23:37
And he was a good one, there’s a guy whose name is Ricky, like a loud, young Latino guy. His family has a cleaning, Office Cleaning Service, right? So thinking outside the box, this guy actually created the technology in training, so so he can help companies, show people how they can become a cleaning company, so they can have access to cleaning contracts, and the guy is making millions for that app. And so who I wish I would have thought of that. I mean, that. So it says good example, that this guy probably and I want to go pee in offices. But he kept the family business with using technology. Now they’re scaling up big time. So that’s the goal here because you know, in our communities, for example, in Chicago, there’s a famous street car 26th Street, which is basically 99% of those businesses are Hispanic gone. But those are immigrants that came to United States with nothing and they started a business and now what’s happening their sons and daughters are graduating from high school from from college and they don’t want to go and work at that particular restaurant. They want to work in technology downtown. So how you combine both right so that’s been a big issue in our chamber. How are you going to encourage your sons and daughters to take over the business and using technology? This So restaurant guy that has 45 restaurants in the city, Chicago, and the sun just to cover the businesses, what are they doing, they kept the business, same recipes and everything. But adding technology now they’re they’re packaging tacos and put them on grocery stores. So that’s the kind of stuff that we’ve seen. And we’re very excited about keeping the restaurant as it is, but using technology to scale and policing design and data that went to college. Right. So that’s, that’s pretty encouraging. That’s very cool.

Brandon Burton 25:28
Yeah, that is very cool. I like that all these examples that you’re you’re showing, or they’re helping others continue as well. So it’s not it’s not replacing another business is not, you know, harming another industry, but it’s, it’s bringing everybody up to a higher level,

Jaime di Paulo 25:46
leveraging that technology for the own use. Really? Exactly.

Brandon Burton 25:50
Yeah. So is there anything else as far as the data and technology that you want to make sure we hit on before we we move on?

Jaime di Paulo 26:01
No, I think you know, chambers should use technology to I mean, you we have a lot of tools out there that can enhance our chambers to the benefit of the members, right? Databases. I mean, the keys are chambers keeping your database and then the, everything you do is not in writing in them or happen. So that’s how we created the technology we created. So this tool, the Kurama tools, because we have 30 years of data. So now we actually know what a pig, what’s a contract that based on data and notes. Right? So that’s how you do it. Really? Yeah.

Brandon Burton 26:37
Yeah, I guess, to your point, when you’re training an AI model, to do something for you, you have to feed it data to be able to learn what it is you’re looking for, and what it needs to put out. So as long as you can, can collect the data up front and all along the way, every interaction, every touch point should have a data point to it, that you can go back to and be able to plug it in, as you see applicable down in the future.

Jaime di Paulo 27:07
You using key words, for example, saving those key words, it’s, it’s called web scraping. So you can actually take a document and show the document, identify this key words, and then it’s tracks that key words and puts it somewhere else. Now you have a you know, now you chamber instead of being, you know, business incubator, at the small business incubator for businesses, you take out the then you just keep small businesses and incubator and those two words are keywords. So now the tool searches for those key words and legislation. And if any bill comes out or any of those key two key words you identified, it flags it, and now you have a couple of key words you can track and you can lobby or whatever.

Brandon Burton 27:53
That makes a lot of sense. That

Jaime di Paulo 27:55
was easy. Well, it sounds easy to explain, but you need to have the back office doing it.

Brandon Burton 28:00
That’s right. That’s right. And then get that machine up and running. Right. And once it gets going, just just keep feeding it that good data. So as we, as we start to wrap up here, I like asking for chamber listening, who’s wanting to take their chamber up to the next level? What kind of tip or action item might you share with them to consider implementing it their organization?

Jaime di Paulo 28:28
Well, you know, first, you know, as every chamber knows, we don’t we don’t we don’t do miracles, right? You get out of the chamber, when you put into the chamber, you know, it’s like, uh, you know, like, I tell my members, look, this is Mina chamber member is like having a, you know, a gym subscription, right? If you don’t go, you don’t, you’re gonna you’re gonna see results. So, partying from that, we need to, you know, people do not come to you just because you name is the Chamber of Commerce, you need to have parents, right, you need to have programs, classes, events, whatever it is to attract people to the chamber. I think that’s the key. So I call them carrots, right? So you wiggle the carrot, and then they’ll come, but you need to Google it. Good, right. So for example, you need to make sure this, you know, chambers were known for network events. Right? Now, it’s a lot of competition and network events. So we’ve got to start thinking outside of the box and how to do events, very more unique and those events because there’s a lot of groups out there doing, you know, after our event, so think outside the box, get some more carrots, encourage corporations to get involved in actually, you know, encourage those corporations to hire those small companies that you represent. That’s the key. And then for example, what I try to do is, for example, a big corporation comes on board as a corporate member. I actually have like, a piece of paper that encourage them it’s not a legal document or anything Ellison just make him sign something as promised, I will give an opportunity to your members to apply for right something that is good to sell to the small businesses so they can come in and be part of the chamber. Sometimes it’s good sometimes they don’t. Right. I

Brandon Burton 30:16
like that. Just a commitment to Medicare and Yeah,

Jaime di Paulo 30:21
nothing. Nothing about it. It’s just on paper, right?

Brandon Burton 30:25
And of a pledge. Yeah, I like that. But I’d like to ask everyone I have on the show as we look to the future of chambers. And I feel like we’ve been talking about this throughout this whole episode here. But as we look to the future of chambers, how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?

Jaime di Paulo 30:43
Well, chambers are the key. There, they’re a necessary tool for small businesses to scale, we have the knowledge, we have the connections, and we have the access to well to your clients, or contracts or whatever it may be, your members need. So Chambers of Commerce will never go away. Because of that reason. Everybody needs somebody, you know, you if you’re an accountant, to focus on your accountant, but you don’t know anything about marketing, we can help you do that. We can help you bring clients to you, we can help you promote your business, we can help you do other things. But you need to focus on your business and give us give the chamber an opportunity that can help you business scale. So it’s like an artist, you know, an artist should be should be drawing pictures, right? Not marketing themselves. So you need to, you know, understand that. That’s what chambers do we help you market your business, we help you scale your business, we’ll help you with connections with with financial, financial institutions. Because the number one thing is small businesses. theme is access to capital. One is me, not every bank is suit for anybody. So we have many we have like a smorgasbord of banks, we can actually know what the what’s the right banking institutions for your particular business, right. So that’s the kind of stuff we bring to the table, the chamber, so we never gonna go away. I mean, if you don’t work, you’re gonna go away. But if you add value to those businesses, you’re good,

Brandon Burton 32:15
right? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I like that idea of, you know, chamber is necessary for businesses to scale. And if your chamber believes that, if your chamber is promoting that, if you’re putting that out as a carrot to attract the businesses, because you have what it takes for them to scale, then you’re right, chambers are not going to go anywhere, and they become necessary in their communities. Okay, we

Jaime di Paulo 32:40
create example. Right? And then we we chambers do a lot of workshops, right with our members, but we never had something structured certified. Right. So we went to the city colleges, which is a local community college. So I told the chancellor, look, let’s create a curriculum, I certify curriculum and and show people how to run a business properly. We did that. So now we launching you know, we had two cohorts or two classes, it’s a 4040 hour class that teach you about finances, marketing, legal stuff. Inventory. So now you we have a certified program, you can people actually go and get a credit, credit, credit, college credit, take this particular class and you when you graduate, you know how to run a business properly, because we know that businesses get into businesses because many reasons and not necessarily everybody is suitable to run a business. So teaching them how to use to how to run a business properly is the key to the success of your business. And so you utilizing the local colleges, you know, get you all members can become teachers, the classes, it’s a win win for everybody, really. So.

Brandon Burton 33:51
Yeah, absolutely creating those good partnerships. Well, as we wrap up here, I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for anyone listening who might be interested in anything you talked about and maybe wants to learn more or just connect with you in general, what would be the best way for someone to reach out and connect?

Jaime di Paulo 34:11
Well, our website is, you know, IHCCBusiness.net HCC meaning Illinois Hispanic Chamber of Commerce. My personal email is jaime@ihccbusiness.net. Those two if you Google our chamber, you can find me on LinkedIn Jaime de Paulo. We have I’m very active on LinkedIn. Our website, you can find me there and you can you know, access all the programs or you can email me for sure and then I will get back to you.

Brandon Burton 34:48
That is perfect. And we’ll get all of that in our show notes for this episode as well so people can pull it up and reach out and connect with you. But Jaime, this has been great having you on Chamber Chat Podcast. I appreciate your time. Taking the time and, and telling us you know what you guys are doing in the realm of data and technology and these AI tools, and you guys are just full of exciting stuff going on right now that really, I think will end up being models for other chambers to follow. So thanks for blazing that trail and sharing some of these insights with us today. I really appreciate it.

Jaime di Paulo 35:19
Thank you, Brandon. I appreciate your time and you know, don’t give up.

Brandon Burton 35:23
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Innovation & Experimentation with Mary Byers

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

Hello, Chamber Champions. Welcome to Chamber Chat Podcast. I’m your hosts Brandon Burton. And it’s my goal here on the podcast to introduce you to people and ideas to better help you serve your Chamber members and your community. You’re joining us for a special episode as part of our 2023 ACCE Chamber the Year Finalist Series.

Let’s hear from Becky Womble, President of the Bastrop Chamber to hear about her experience with Community Matters.

Learn how you can partner with Community Matters, Inc. to produce your next Chamber Directory, Community Guide or Map.

Our guest for this episode is Mary Byers, Mary is co author for of Race for Relevance, Five Radical Changes for Associations and Road to Relevance, Five Strategies for Competitive Associations. She’s the former director of communications and Member Services for the Illinois Dental Society, and served in that capacity for nine years prior to starting her consulting business in 1998. Mary specializes in working with volunteer association leaders and chief staff executives to help define their roles and clarify their vision through leadership conference programming, facilitating strategic planning retreats and coaching. Mary is a certified Association Executive and a certified speaking professional. She is also the author of nine books. That Mary, I’m excited to have you with us today on Chamber Chat Podcast, I’d love to give you a moment to say hello to all the Chamber Champions that are out there listening and to share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better.

Mary Byers 2:58
I appreciate that. Brandon, I’m delighted to be here. And I love the impact that chambers make on the business leaders in the community and the communities themselves. So extra special day for me in terms of helping encourage your audience. Something interesting about me that not many people know is that I am a frustrated tap dancer. I love it. My feet just don’t move as quickly as I would like them to. And I’m also a amateur improv lover. So that’s I’ve been taking some improv lessons lately. And I’m looking forward to more. That’s

Brandon Burton 3:38
awesome. I can see where the speech and improv have some correlations and some crossover when you’re on the stage and needing to think on the fly. So that it goes along with professional development, right?

Mary Byers 3:51
I think it definitely for in my case, especially Sure, right? Absolutely.

Brandon Burton 3:57
Well, normally, I would ask you how you know about your chamber size staff budget, but since you’re not a chamber, let’s just tell us a little about a little bit about the consulting work you do kind of who you try to work with impact to try to make the kind of course that you take and just give us a little bit of background.

Mary Byers 4:18
I started as an association staffer for one state level organization and one for an international organization. And that led into the work that I do you have now and I work with a wide variety of organization, trade associations, professional membership societies, and I work with them of all shapes and sizes. I’ve worked with over 400 of them. And that gives me a view of what’s happening, what’s challenging organizations but I also recognize that each is unique and they have their own culture, history and traditions. So I love being able to encourage Association chamber professionals. to share what I’m seeing in the marketplace, and then to provide some resources for them so that as they grow in their roles and in their organizations, they have some resources to help them do that. Absolutely.

Brandon Burton 5:12
That’s great work you’re involved with. So for our topic for our discussion today, we settled on the idea of talking about innovation and experimentation. And I love this idea because chambers of commerce, as you’re probably aware, and and I would venture to say associations in general are always looking to what they can do to remain relevant to their members and and the people they serve. So I think innovation and experimentation is crucial to remaining relevant, and we will dive much deeper into this conversation as soon as we get back from this quick break.

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Donna Novitsky 7:42
Hi, it’s me, Donna from Yiftee. Have I mentioned that we’re working with chambers and other leaders on community cards in more than 500 cities across the US. Yiftee is the undisputed leader in community cards because we did it first and have learned a lot and because it’s free for you to set up and free for your members to participate. Plus, we do all the heavy lifting for you. Many chambers have chamber checks or other similar programs. Imagine the benefits of those without the extra costs of staffing, creating and tracking checks and reconciling payments. Community cards are all digital, sold online and always available on the cardholders cell phone. We provide tons of training and marketing materials. Come check us out yiftee.com or email sales@yiftee.com. Back to you Brandon.

Brandon Burton 8:37
All right, Mary, we’re back from our break there. And as I mentioned, before we we took that pause. We’re focusing our discussion today around innovation and experimentation. And I know you as the author of the book race for relevance, this correlates very well. But I guess first of all, what what should chambers and associations be thinking about? Now as we’re sitting in 2023? And, and I hope we’re safe and saying post pandemic? What are what are some of those things they should be focusing on?

Mary Byers 9:13
Okay, first of all, let me define how I think about innovation. If I walked into the room and said, I want you to come up with a new program and service from scratch. That’s intimidating. It’s overwhelming. It’s hard to do. So when I talk about innovation, I’m really talking about doing something differently. And when you look at it that way, we’re looking at small changes, possibly making big differences. We’re looking at experimentation, as you mentioned, and we’ll talk more about that as we go along. But But small risks, calculated risks, and then learning from the market as we take some of those small risks. And then the other thing that I would encourage people to be thinking about is What I call the 10% pledge. And that is committing to evolve 10% of what you’re currently doing, whether it’s 10% of your fundraising, 10% of your programming, 10% of your special projects, 10% of your communications, that way, you are engaged in continuous innovation or continuous improvement, which some organizations call it, and it doesn’t become a thing that we have to go to the board and ask for permission to do, it becomes something that becomes part and parcel of who we are. And we know that member’s needs were changing prior to the pan damnit, as I like to call it, because I think that’s just an apt description of what we’ve been through. And they’re, they’re changing as a result on the other side as well, too. And if we are continuously evolving, then we don’t have to engage in these big projects or big programs or big changes, and there might need to be some revolutionary innovation. But I think evolutionary innovation is more realistic for chambers, quite honestly. Yeah.

Brandon Burton 11:12
In fact, as you’re talking about that 10% pledge, I think, as chambers often, if they have an event or something of that nature, they’re conducting surveys and collecting data, either along the way, or post event. And, excuse me, collecting that data is perfect to put into that 10%, as you’re talking about to build to make those incremental changes as evolutionary changes, to continue improving and staying relevant. So I think that’s a great tip.

Mary Byers 11:41
And I’m surprised by how many organizations do surveying, especially post event serving, and then when it’s time to plan next year, somehow that data has stuck at it. We don’t look at it, we don’t use it. And yet, if we’re really listening to our market and our members, and we’re hearing what’s being said, many of the ideas that would help us innovate, are there. We don’t even have to come up with them. We just have to respond to them. Right?

Brandon Burton 12:13
Yeah, absolutely. So and I think that’s, that’s great. So the explanation you had there about how you look at innovation and experimentation, I think is great for kind of setting that mindset as we go about our discussion today. But maybe going back to that question about what what associations and chambers need to be thinking about, as we’re in this post pandemic timeframe.

Mary Byers 12:39
If I were sitting in a leadership role with an organization, I would be asking several questions. One wouldn’t be have members needs and expect expectations changed? And if so how? I would be asking, What can we help members do that they can’t do for themselves? Because I think that helps lead to our value proposition. And I would also be asking, how can we help members work less stressfully more profitably, and more productively? And I think one of the things that challenge chambers quite honestly, is you don’t have just one type of business, represented in the chamber, you’re not all restaurants, you’re not all retail stores. And every group has different needs. And so it’s, I guess another thing that I would encourage them to think about is segmenting their membership, and taking a look at the different categories represented. And then if you think about a Venn diagram, you know, that harkens back to grade school or high school, what are the commonalities, so if you do have restaurants, and you do have golf courses, and you do have retail shops, where are the common needs, and then if you can focus on those common needs, you’re going to be relevant to more of your membership, rather than being fragmented. And when everything is important, nothing is important. So I think an exercise of this nature helps focus. And when we focus we can make more of an impact.

Brandon Burton 14:18
Absolutely. And I couldn’t agree more and trying to figure out what are those common needs and and oftentimes a Venn diagram is a good way to visualize that see, where all that overlap is and where to where to focus that that time and effort. I think as we are recording this for May of 2023. Technology is abuzz right now with all sorts of things from blockchain to AI to you name it, but how do you see technology, the relevance of technology for a chamber and you know the relevance of it in adopting it and experimenting with it.

Mary Byers 15:02
Base for relevance came out in 2011. And in 2021, we produced an anniversary 10th anniversary edition. And one of the things I’m proud of, is the fact that the chapter on technology completely changed the base 10, meaning that technology is extremely important to how we deliver programs and service was the same. But we had new case studies, new data. We believe that this has to be an important aspect of strategy for organizations. So in addition to his strategic plan, I believe all chambers should also have a technology plan. I years ago, a friend of mine who’s a realtor suggested that we look around every year in our house and ask if we were going to sell our home this year, what would we need to do, and pick one project and do it. And the reason she suggested that is then we could enjoy the upgrades while we were living in the home rather than waiting to upgrade before we sold the home. And we also would be ready, then when it was time to sell the home, there wouldn’t be a long list of things that we had to do, because we had been keeping up with it. And I think the same thing is true with chambers, I think each year, we need to look around and say if we were going to upgrade our technology, what would we do? And then we need to go do it. We actually in 2011, we took a look at what percentage associations were spending on technology, it was 4.1% of their budgets. And when that got to that it was actually 1.6%. And yet, when you look at the impact that technology has on how we can deliver member programs and services, it’s huge. So our research show that for profit companies, we’re spending around seven to 8% of their gross revenue, not their net gross ology. So if we were to even aspire to half of that, we would be in a better position. So not only do we need a strategic plan, we need a technology plan. And we need to know and most know, most technology plans are going to last longer than a year, because technology is changing constantly. And as you said, new things are being introduced AI, we’re still looking at the impact of that. But part of the challenges for many or Chamber organizations, especially they are they’re varying sizes, and they have varying budgets, but we must double down on our commitment to technology. Here’s a question and additional question to be thinking about, and that is, how can we take the chamber to members, rather than always asking members to come to the chamber? Right. And technology’s one way to do that?

Brandon Burton 17:56
Absolutely. So I think that’s fascinating looking at the percentage being spent on technology in associations versus, you know, in the the for profit world. And yeah, I guess there’s the caveat with that is a lot of these technology, software’s will say, and we’ll have a free or maybe a nonprofit rate. So there’s reasons you could justify why they spend less and, you know, be be resourceful, by all means, but the point is to start integrating some of that technology. In your research and case studies, Were there certain things that stood out to you that would maybe be that, like, going back to your analogy of getting your house ready for sale, right, like a kitchen bathrooms, those things have the biggest ROI, right? So as you look at associations, what kinds of things technology wise, would you say, have the most ROI to try to implement implement sooner than later,

Mary Byers 18:55
making sure that you have a database that is flexible, so that you can actually pull data that you need and can use without investing a lot of time into that. I think a lot of associations don’t even realize what kind of data they’re sitting on. And so they’re not using, that’d be the first thing that making sure that your database is robust and flexible, so that it will help you with what you need. We also want to be thinking about automating and systematizing. Most chambers have smaller staffs. I’m surprised sometimes by the way that we are still manually taking registrations handling new dues or you know, new members. So anything that would help us streamline our workload, because we want to free up our staff to do the things that staff does best and that is relationship building, interfacing with members troubleshooting, solving problems getting out into the community. So any thing that would free up staff time, I think would be an important piece of it. Right? Our web presence absolutely needs to be modern, easy to search. Friendly. If you think about it, it is our first impression. When members are interested in joining, they go to the website. So how user friendly is it? We have to think about the member experience, when I find what I need, when I need it? Are things streamlined? Is it frustrating? How hard is it to use that I always tell people go try to join your organization. And pretend you have never seen your website or your processes before. So see it with fresh eyes, and then find the places that are frustrating. And then start with those.

Brandon Burton 20:49
I would say I would add, you know, have somebody who’s totally not in the chamber world. Look at your website, you know how? Because then you’ll know is your website telling the story of what your chamber does, like will that individual have an understanding of what a chamber is or what your chamber is? In your points on that the automation, I think of the example of the dentists you know, who goes to dental school, they learn how to be a great dentist, that’s what they do is they work on teeth, but if they have to spend, you know, 50% of their day, doing paperwork and moving things along the process, when there’s tools out there that will move it along. And that that would be the equivalent of the chamber being out there in the community and helping businesses be successful. And there’s tools like like Zapier, you know, that will connect a lot of these other technologies to be able to move things along in the process automatically. And, and relatively inexpensive. So you need to be exploring those different options, because there’s, there’s a lot of great tools, but you got to set aside that that 10% of the time to study it, research it and explore it, right. Yeah,

Mary Byers 22:00
and that’s one of the great things we’ve seen change in the last 10 years, since the first edition of the book was written, we now have more options, more apps, more plugins, it used to be that you would have to do a huge technology upgrade. And we’d go to the board and we’d get money. And then we would go through all the stress and strain of getting the new application installed. And then we would just live with that until it was time to do another upgrade. But you know, much like looking around your house and seeing what needs to be done. We can do that with technology now. And we can, we can say this is working, this isn’t we need to change this out, we need to plug this in. So we’ve got more flexibility. And now that we’ve gone to service as a subscription model, it’s more affordable. So rather than having a huge upfront commitment financially, we can basically pay as we go. Now, that doesn’t mean that it’s gotten, you know, so much cheaper, that technology isn’t going to take a bite out of our budget. But I think we have to recognize the power of technology, and make sure that it is creating the kind of return on investment that we deserve for that, for that investment that we’re making

Brandon Burton 23:19
on that pay as you go model allows you to experiment a little more to and see if it really does work before you commit to buying a whole big price tag package. So I know you had shared a tip earlier on this. But I wanted to ask specifically about how to build a culture of innovation at a chamber. You know, there’s the old saying of you know, things have always been done this way. And of course, you want to break that mold. So how do you create a culture where people are thinking kind of what is that next step? What is what is the thing we can do to improve what we do here at our organization.

Mary Byers 23:58
The first thing I think we have to acknowledge is the importance of innovation, because the only way we’re going to change is by innovating. And this became an area of interest to me after the book was written because I started noticing the difference between organizations that were thriving, versus those that were just surviving. And those that were thriving, were actively innovating. They had a not only a verbal commitment to it, but a strategic commitment to it. They recognize that innovation requires experimentation. And so they change their language around how they even talk about it. They don’t talk in terms of success and failure. They talk in terms of success and learning. And so that takes some of the stigma away from innovation. So there has to be a commitment. There has to be it has to be part of the cultural value. We have to recognize and reward innovation, rather than punish it when It doesn’t work. And honestly, the board really has to have buy in for that, because the board’s role is to make sure that the Chamber has the expertise and the funding that they need to innovate. So some organizations actually have a line item in their budget, dedicated to innovation so that the staff doesn’t have to go to the board every time they want to try something new. They also other organizations will earmark a percentage of reserves, perhaps each year toward innovation. So we want to make the barriers to innovation as low as possible. And if I have to beg for money, every time I want to try something new, that certainly doesn’t encourage innovation, it actually discourages it. So the board has to really understand the role of innovation, they need to support it, and they need to adequately finance fit.

Brandon Burton 25:54
Yeah, I like that. I like the whole mindset of success and learning. So it’s not success and failure, success and learning. So I wanted to ask you, you’ve got a phrase called dual transformation. So how can dual transformation help a chamber remain relevant.

Mary Byers 26:12
So this is actually a concept from the for profit world. And dual transformation really means that you service today’s business model, while you’re building the future of the organization. So I’ll give you an example of what this might have looked like for a group at one of my clients actually explained it to me is flying the airplane while you’re still building. Yeah, and that’s, I think that was kind of a good metaphor. And, you know, very picturesque when you think about keeping a plane afloat while still building it. You know, we’ve seen a moved for, for some organizations to go to a tiered membership model. So this isn’t a chamber, but the Colorado Veterinary Medical Association adopted a tiered model in 2016, because they wanted members to essentially be able to choose their own adventure. So they have three package levels. The first level really was for those who were just getting started in veterinary medicine maybe didn’t have a lot of financial resources, but they wanted to offer them a home, and access to some education and resources that would be beneficial to them. The middle package was the one they expected most members to take advantage of. And it was the package that offered what previously had been available for their membership. And then the third package essentially was for the whole practice. So you pay more, you can enroll as many people in your practice as you want into the membership. And they built the model that way that other organizations have gone to a subscription model from a membership annual membership model. They’re billing on a monthly basis or a quarterly basis. And again, it’s flexibility. They’re letting their members choose how they want to engage. So those are some examples of small changes that have had a big impact. One group that I’m familiar with, when they went to the subscription model, the monthly model actually increased their membership by 11%, just by offering them flexibility. So it wasn’t a huge change, although they had a few things they had to do on the back end with the technology. And they had to do a little bit of experimentation there to see how that was going to work. But that’s one of my favorite things about it, quite honestly is a small changes can have a big difference. But the dual transformation idea is that you are doing everything you need to do in 2023 to meet members needs, simultaneously, thinking about what your membership model is going to look like what the business model is going to look like in 2020 before 2025 2026. So it’s actually made things a little bit more complex, because we have to worry about today and tomorrow at the same time. But it’s a concept I think that is worth borrowing from for profit, America, especially when we talk to our boards about the complexity of the environment. One of the other things that we’ve seen change in the last 10 years is competition has heated up and it is coming from all sorts of places. I think we have to acknowledge how that’s challenging our models and use innovation to mitigate the impact on chambers.

Brandon Burton 29:49
Yeah, I like that. The dual transformation doing what you need to do today, while also looking at the future reminds me though the Wayne Gretzky quote about skating to where the puck is going right. He’s in the game. He’s doing what he needs to do, but he’s going to where the puck is going. And I think that’s so crucial for us to have our eye on the future and not be left in the past. So no, admittedly,

Mary Byers 30:11
Wayne makes it sound really easy, right. So I think he had a sixth sense that a lot of other hockey players didn’t have. And I’m pretty sure he had eyes on the side in the back of his head, too, because that’s almost what it takes to be able to skate to where the puck is going.

Brandon Burton 30:28
And he already knew that I escaped. So that’s a big accomplishment.

Mary Byers 30:33
I would agree with that. Right.

Brandon Burton 30:35
So as we begin to wrap things up here, I like asking if you have any tip or strategy or action items that you would suggest for listeners who are interested in taking their chamber up to the next level.

Mary Byers 30:49
So this is going to sound too simple, and counterintuitive, but it’s the best tip I have to offer chamber professionals. And that is get away from the office on a quarterly basis. I’ve been doing this since 2016. And I actually found a retreat center that is close to me. And I check in with a pad of paper, my calendar and a pen. And I try to minimize electronics. And even if I have a cell phone with me, I put my Do Not Disturb on and I try not to look at it until it’s bedtime on the first night. And then I usually work until noon or late in the day, second day. And essentially what I’m doing is I’m dividing my year into quarters. And I’m looking at what needs my attention over the next quarter. And the next year. And I’m making some longer term plans. I’m making some longer strategy plans. One of the first things I did when I started this is I went back, and I chunked my career. Okay, what was true about the start of my career, what became true about the next piece of my career, and essentially, I was able to identify pivot points. And I think this has value to a chamber exec as well set aside some time to go back and look over the past couple of years past five years, 10 years, your whole your chambers whole history. Where were there strategic decisions made. That allowed the, the chamber to get momentum, or to really make an impact. And understanding backwards will actually help you strategize forwards. So that was the long way of saying, I think chamber execs need to get out of the office for at least a day, four times a year, no phones, no members, no interruptions, and strictly think about how they think about strategy. And to look at both the past and the future, and to look at where they can get pivot points that will help accelerate the value and relevance of their chambers going forward. So

Brandon Burton 33:12
as you do this, how long do you take when you Is it two days, three days a week? Usually,

Mary Byers 33:19
I do it overnight. And I plan on the first day and I spend most of the second day. So I would say on average, it’s a day and a half. Okay, so I’m spending three what is that day and a half day and a half, three, six, I’m spending six full days a year outside of my office, away from any interruptions. And I find that the more time I spend on the front end, the more I gain on the back end. So when I do it, I’m strategizing about my own business. But I’m also strategizing about my clients and how I serve them. And so the equivalent for a chamber would be strategizing about their role, their personal role in growth and development, and then also strategizing on behalf of how the organization serves members and how that’s changing. And I really believe that the changes we were seeing before the pandemic have been accelerated. But the pandemic gave us a tailwind. And now we have a choice coming out of this. And I think of it as no longer business as usual, but business as unusual. And how can we harness what’s happened for the good of our chambers. I also like to think about whether what we’re seeing is for now, or forever. So we’re coming out of the pandemic now. And so some of the trends that we’re seeing now may or may not be in existence in two, five or 10 years, that if some of the trends are in existence in two or five years, what does that mean for your organization? For a lot of chambers, they became more relevant because they were answering questions for members about, can we open? How can we open? When can we open? What does that look like, depending on what state they were located in? So that crisis actually increased our relevance. What can we learn from where we leaned in, during the pandemic that will help us going forward in our chamber?

Brandon Burton 35:21
I love that. That’s a great, great tip there. Say, I like asking all the guests that I have on the show as we look to the future of chambers of commerce, how would you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?

Mary Byers 35:38
I am very bullish on the future of all associations and chambers. However, in order to remain relevant, we’re going to have to continuously evolve. I do not think that if we stayed the same, that we will be as meaningful. Comfort and complacency are the enemy of relevance. And that’s why I think every chamber professional needs to be focused on continuously evolving what their business model looks like. Yeah,

Brandon Burton 36:11
and that’s so difficult, right? We say comfort and complacency are the enemy and, and that’s all human nature wants is to be comfortable. They don’t want to do the hard thing. You don’t want to do the painful thing. But those are the things that see growth and positive change is being able to push through and get out of that comfort zone. I think that’s it,

Mary Byers 36:32
I think, because there was so much stress and pressure and innovating on the fly. I think for many people, we’re sort of like, we’re in recovery mode. Right now. We’re sort of like who, wow, we made it through that. But we also build resilience muscles. And my biggest fear is that we our desire to go back is stronger than our desire to create a proactive go forward strategy. So I do think there is a role for rest and recovery. But we have to be careful that that doesn’t become our modus operandi. You know, we were tired, we were overwhelmed. We got through it. Now we got to keep going. Right? Absolutely.

Brandon Burton 37:16
Well, Mary, this has been a great conversation, I appreciate the the point of view and perspective that you bring to this topic, I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for listeners who might want to reach out and learn more and connect with you what would be the best way for them to do that?

Mary Byers 37:34
I appreciate that. Brandon, thank you. It’s simply my marybyers.com. There are resources there. And I also have AssociationInnovation.today. We did a report with loyalty Research Center, where we took a look at what high performing innovative organizations are doing. And there is a free report there. So anybody that’s interested in building an innovative culture in their organization can access that report. There’s a lot of food for thought. We talked about weak innovation, culture, strong innovation culture as we talk about how its funded. And we just talked about what you should be thinking about if you want to be an innovator.

Brandon Burton 38:19
Awesome. Yeah, everybody needs to take you up on that and go see that that free report. So well. We’ll have both of those websites linked in our show notes for this episode, so people can hop on there and click through to the websites. But Mary, thank you for spending time with us today on chamber chat podcast for sharing your insights and, and the future looking vision that you have for associations and chambers of commerce. I really do appreciate it.

Mary Byers 38:47
Thank you. It’s been my privilege to be here. And thank you for the work that you do because I believe that educating, encouraging, connecting, and allowing people to tap into other people’s good ideas is where many forms of innovation come from. So thanks for your work as well.

Brandon Burton
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Clean Energy & Chambers with Ryan Evans

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Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.

Let’s hear from Becky Womble, President of the Bastrop Chamber to hear about her experience with Community Matters.

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Our guest for this episode is Ryan Evans. Ryan joined the Chamber for Innovation and Clean Energy in March 2019 and serves as the executive director. Prior to being named Executive Director Ryan was a member of CICS National Advisory Board for six years. Previously, Ryan served as president of the Utah Solar Energy Association for three years, which is a trade association he co founded was an executive for 13 years with the Salt Lake Chamber, which is one of the largest chambers of commerce in the country, and served as the Executive Administrator for the Utah State Chamber of Commerce. Ryan is a recognized leader and regional speaker both locally and nationally on renewable energy policy and economic impacts of air quality community engagement and relationship building. Ryan is an IOM graduate, and now serves on the US Chambers National Board of Trustees. Ryan attended the University of Vermont and graduated with a bachelor’s degree in psychology from the University of Utah. Ryan, I’m excited to have you with us today here on Chamber Chat Podcast, love to give you an opportunity to say hello to all the Chamber Champions out there listening and share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better.

Ryan Evans 3:12
Thank you, Brandon, appreciate the opportunity to be on the chamber chat podcast. Listen to you a bunch of times. And this is great to actually be able to speak with you and speak with the Chamber Champions listening in today. Something fun for me, I guess, in terms of interest for me, I’ve been in the chamber and association industry for just over 20 years now. It’s kind of crazy how that journey started. I was an entrepreneur. Prior to being in the chamber industry, I own my own restaurant, I was a trained chef at one point when that when I left that partnership as a lot of restaurants don’t, you know, have the tendency to fail. I was one of those. One of those cases, started looking for a job that would maybe help given or maybe work given my managerial background, but not something that actually I didn’t want to start from scratch again. So I started looking for sales positions, knowing that at least that way, if I worked hard, I could make money. And sure enough, the Salt Lake chamber was hiring at the time. And little did I know that that would lead to a 20 year career after starting they’re making $13,000 An hour plus or $13,000.

Brandon Burton 4:18
Are they still hiring? Let me sign up

Ryan Evans 4:22
1000 a year plus commissions and I made it work pretty good. But yeah, 30,000 hour would be one heck of an opportunity. That’s right. So I know that that all steamrolled into, you know getting into clean energy and eventually this role here where I get to meld both the clean energy world and the Chamber history that I have, and it’s a great relationship. So it’s been great. Absolutely. It’s

Brandon Burton 4:44
like your background has been perfect for this union to bring into the chambers for innovation to clean energy very much. So speaking to that, tell us a little bit about the chambers of the chambers for innovation, clean energy, just kind of The size, the scope of work staff, just give us some perspective of where you’re coming from, with the organization to kind of set the stage for our discussion today. Absolutely, thank

Ryan Evans 5:10
you. So chambers renovation and clean energy as we affectionately like to call it, CIC II, as you alluded to Brandon, we are a national network of about 1300 chambers and economic development associations across the country, doesn’t mean we work with every single one of those every single year. But those are the groups that we stay in touch with quite a bit that we work with. Our whole role is to help advance the clean energy economy, at chambers innovation in clean energy, we’re not an environmental group, we’re not anti anything, we are strictly clean energy experts, and help to look to educate chambers on how they can capitalize on this growing segment of our economy, how they can be better involved in promoting good clean energy policy, how they can what what they need to know, to better understand the technology that exists and how to get past a lot of the misinformation that’s out there, whether Pro or negative regarding clean energy, we do a lot of best practice sharing of what chambers are doing across the country. And then we’ll get in and we’ll even advise chambers on particular public policy issues at the state or local level that they may be experiencing. firsthand. So again, we you know, our whole role is to work with chambers. And we do that for free. We have funding in place that allows us to work with any chamber anywhere. Typically, I mentioned 1300. But typically we work with we try to work in about seven or eight priority states at one time. And he states where we spend a little extra time, given that they’ve got more opportunity for clean energy or more challenges being presented for clean energy. And so we sort of rotate that out on on any given year. But as of right now, the states where we spend most of our time are Ohio, North Carolina, Florida, Arizona, Colorado, South Carolina, Virginia, and in some work in the Northeast as

Brandon Burton 7:04
well. All right, well, that definitely helps give some perspective as to the kind of work you’re involved with and the the approach you take with some of the these chambers and 1300 chambers that you work with. As we focus our discussion today. I’m kind of halfway joking. But when I say we’re going to talk about clean energy and chambers, even if they don’t think that it matters or something that they care about at the moment, we’ll talk about why it does matter. And how your local chamber can get involved, why you should be involved, what opportunities are out there. And we’ll dive into this discussion much deeper as soon as you get back from this quick break.

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Donna Novitsky 9:33
Hi, everyone, Donna from Yiftee here with another fun fact about small businesses. Did you know that there are 77 million people working in small businesses in the US? That’s almost half of the entire civilian workforce. But I know that you already know the value of local businesses. That is why we created community cards. They bring revenue to your members’ businesses that today is leaving your community and going to national brands and e-commerce companies. In addition to consumers we see schools, hospitals, city governments and companies buying community cards in bulk instead of buying big box store and online gift cards. Community cards keep local dollars local. For more info come to a demo or email us at sales@yiftee.com. We look forward to meeting you back to you Brandon.

Brandon Burton 10:27
All right, Ryan, we’re back. So as I alluded to, before the break, today, we’re diving into how chambers can get involved with with clean energy, why they should care, maybe that’s a good starting point, as far as why chamber should care about focusing on clean energy. And then you mentioned a couple items, you know, before the break is to, you know, the economic impact and things like that. But talk to us a little bit about why chambers should have clean energy on their radar and be intentional about trying to promote clean energy in their communities.

Ryan Evans 11:02
Sure, thank you. You know, honestly, this conversation would have been pretty different five years ago. But now, I think there’s no doubt that anybody, you know, nobody has a doubt that we are in the midst of an energy transformation in the United States of America and across the across the globe, really, we are, over the last several years, clean energy speed between solar and wind have been responsible for more than 90% of new electric generation built across the country. So in other words, we still have a lot of our electricity coming from natural gas, which is the number one on the fossil fuel side. And again, we’re not anti anything, we’re all of the above, we just truly know that the Clean Energy Economics will win out in the end, as natural gas started to actually overtake coal. Many years ago, when coal was the workhorse for electricity, then it became natural gas. And it still is natural gas. But now it’s really starting to shift towards more renewable energy sources. So that’s sort of number one is that we’re looking at the future of America being very much powered, whether it’s 100%, like some people think, or at least very high into the 80s, a 90%, by some sort of cleaner energy than we have now. So that’s a significant number one. Number two, your members care about their utility bills. That’s one of the highest costs of doing business in any state. So what is your electricity and heating bills look like? And where is that source of that pain point coming from? In most states, that’s still natural gas. And for a long time, natural gas was a great lower cost option for communities. Now, however, we’ve seen, especially in the last two years, the fluctuation within the volatility of natural gas pricing. So a lot of corporations are really being attracted to the fact that solar and wind are now the cheapest form of electricity you can get. And when you enter into a contract for these corporations that again, are members of chambers all over the country, they’re locking into those price points that they sign these contracts for, for anywhere from 20 to 35 years. So there’s absolute predictability in their electrical costs going forward, at least for that segment that they’re getting from clean energy. The other factor that I’ll mention is it just brings it back to home wherever you are, there are clean energy jobs being created on a regular basis. There are more people in employed in the solar industry alone than all of fossil fuel industries combined. That’s just solar. That’s not wind, that’s not electric vehicles. That’s not batteries and energy storage, and energy efficiency. So clean energy is a job creator, like no other. And then it brings home capital investment, it brings home economic opportunities and tax revenues for communities. So there are lots of reasons why chambers should engage or at least be interested, and at the very least be willing to provide good information to their communities, because there’s just there’s a lot to it. And a lot of voices get heard. And I think it’s given the amount of opportunity and challenges there are, it’s just important to at least be a good provider of information for your members and your community as a whole.

Brandon Burton 14:32
Right. So it’s been a couple of years ago now but our electric provider, I’m in Texas in our electric provider, we’re part of a co op and each year they do a brisket dinner, you know so we can go and as a member of the Co Op, they provide the brisket dinner, they do a little dog and pony show about the work they’re doing and at this particular dinner I was at they put up on the slideshow, this solar farm that they had and like, Wait, that’s like, right around the corner from my house. And I had no idea that the solar farm was there. And sure enough, I’m pulling up the Google satellite images, and it’s, you know, probably a mile from my house, and had no idea. But if it was a natural gas plant or something else, like, other things would definitely stand out, and you would notice, but um, just the clean energy can make such an impact in a community without being, you know, super noticeable. But so I think that our Electric Co Op did a good job of explaining that. But as far as the chamber goes, he said, you know, most importantly, even if it’s just sharing, you know, accurate good information with their community with their members. Obviously, we can point them to you to your organization to get some that that good information to share. But as the chamber looks to get involved and say, Yeah, this is important that we create jobs in clean energy, because that’s where the future is going. Or it’s important for us to help lower those utility rates for our member businesses, and for just our community in general to be able to thrive more and have more discretionary income, all these different points that you touched on the job creation. If a chamber wanted to get involved, where do they start with being able to try to move the ball try to move the needle, so to speak in their community?

Ryan Evans 16:27
There’s, there’s quite a few places you can start. And actually, I want to jump back really quick if it’s okay, Brandon, and just common, Texas, just because you brought up Texas and you brought up two things that I’m pretty passionate about. One is realistically, most solar installations you don’t notice. So you’re absolutely right, there’s a lot of misinformation that they’re obstructive that they’re an eyesore. But yet, most times people have no idea that they’re within a mile or two of their home, because they have that low profile, and you can put up trees around them, you can put up shrubs and bushes around them. So I appreciate and love the fact that you didn’t even notice not necessarily. But then also just on Texas really quick. It’s Texas is one of my favorite stories to tell because even though they have been traditionally one of the the number one oil and gas state in the country, and they are known as an oil and gas state and Houston particular huge oil and gas market, right. Yet, Texas is the number two state in the nation for most solar installations in terms of size of those installations combined. And number one, as far as wind, this is a state that truly embraces the all of the above energy form, you know, mentality in an incredible way. And, you know, chambers, like the Greater Houston partnership, for example, are all in on this all of the above factor and even looking at new technologies like carbon capture, and all these other great things that we see out there. So I just want to throw my you know, throw a shout out for taxes just in terms of, you know, that typical state that has learned that they don’t have to just be dependent on that fossil fuel economy that there is this huge other opportunity out there for the state and for electrical ratepayers and whatnot.

Brandon Burton 18:07
I will say if you ever drive between Abilene and San Angelo, you will see the wind. As far as your eye can see, you will see windmills. So

Ryan Evans 18:16
yeah, there’s a lot of places around the country that are like that, where you just see them. But a lot of cases, there’s really not much else there. So they may as well, Saturday. Right, right. And you know, as far as how you get involved, there’s lots of ways number one, I guarantee that almost every single chamber in the country has some sort of clean energy industry a company within their membership, it may not be a solar installer, it may not be a manufacturer of solar or wind turbine parts. But it might be somebody who supplies workforce to that it might be a company that is a fencing company that puts up temporary fencing around renewable energy installations as they’re going up. So there’s, it’s incredible the supply chain that exists out into the clean energy world. So one, look at your own membership and see who’s there and see what the important issues are to talk to your utility. I always recommend you, you know, work with your utility on clean energy, because ultimately, they’re going to be the one that does a lot of it outside of the private companies that develop. But don’t also take the utilities word for it completely ask questions, look for what might be the best opportunities for your entire region and start a business Coalition for you know, that looks at sustainability and clean energy by starting a committee like that. It’s amazing what you’ll learn from your members in terms of what they’re doing to either procure clean energy on their own or through the utility, what they’re doing internally to improve their emissions outcomes so they’re more sustainable. It’s it’s pretty impressive to see what businesses do and it’s one great thing chambers can do is promote what their businesses are doing. Proactiv basis as well, that’s that’s just a great thing. Another thing that you can do, if you want to get involved is reach out to us, of course, I’m not going to give a sales pitch there. But that’s what we do. If there’s, you know, we’re happy to chat with any chamber anywhere all the time, just to say, hey, here’s the hotspots that we see, maybe this is a chance for you to engage. And lastly, look in your state for some sort of a state level clean energy or solar industry association. So prior to, as you mentioned, in the my introduction, I was the president and founder of the Utah solar industry association, we worked with chambers all across the state, trying to help educate them on solar policy and clean energy policy and how they can help protect the jobs that, you know, we’re being built by this industry within the state. So look to those associations and bring them as partners or ask them to be members, so they can kind of make sure your members are informed on the hot topics of the day regarding the clean energy industries. Yeah.

Brandon Burton 20:58
So I don’t mean to keep going back to stuff to this example, in Texas. So chambers are known for being conveners, right. And as I see a lot of this land, like with these wind farms that we’re talking about, not only are they wind farms, but they have their oil rigs that are going, they have their cattle that are grazing on the fields. And so they’ve got multiple streams of income using this land that’s very agricultural based. And if a chamber can see and recognize these opportunities, be that convener to make some introductions to help introduce some of these clean energy capabilities. On to that, that rancher or that person who has an oil rig set up or whatever it may be, I mean, we’re talking things that are very hyper focused in Texas, for sure. But other parts of the country, the land may be used for something else, but it could also be used, in addition to for wind or solar. So that convener make those introductions. Yeah,

Ryan Evans 21:58
no, that’s a great point number one. Yeah. So always and chamber should know this. And they do know this. And mean, chambers are conveners of the voice of business, the, you know, the, they’re the convener of the business communities, and realistically for their whole community. So there is an opportunity just to talk to people about what is possible. And yeah, in Texas, you will often see wind turbines right next to oil rigs, and maybe cattle grazing as well. In Ohio, you may see a solar installation, where, you know, maybe 5%, of a generational farm is being utilized for solar energy along with 5% of another farm nearby them and 10% of another farm nearby them. But those, that five or 10% of the farm property is actually giving annual revenue anywhere from 100,000 to $300,000. A year to those farm owners. And a lot of cases, it’s helping keep farmland in a family name and helping them not to have to sell it off, or because it’s a lease arrangement, or even turn some other land into a subdivision for homes. I mean, that’s, that’s just and once you put homes in that property’s gone with a solar installation for, you know, for example, in a rural farming community, typically those panels have been in the ground for, you know, 30 to 35 years, but at the same time, like you say, you’re farming on the rest of your property, you can still do some agriculture underneath the solar panels. And a lot of case you can still graze animals like sheep throughout an entire solar area. So yeah, there are lots of other ways that you can promote the land and utilize the land for economic or just community benefit.

Brandon Burton 23:40
Right. And from the farmer perspective, I say, you know, there’s a lot of government subsidies for farmers to either not grow a crop or to grow, you know, more, you know, mono cropping, you know, which has its own issues. So to be able to introduce another stream of income for these farmers could really help them actually farm what they need to and want to farm versus what the government’s paying them to do. And it gives them a lot more freedom. Absolutely. And

Ryan Evans 24:07
if you get farmer start on this, a lot of them are going to tell you, this is a property rights thing. If I want to put solar on my farm, I want to put solar on my farm, and they get pretty passionate about it speak out in lots of different state houses across the country on their property rights. And it’s don’t get in the middle of a farmer and their property rights. I’ll tell you that much right now.

Brandon Burton 24:25
That’s right. So for chambers that are listening, I’d like to hear maybe a an innovative example or two where you’ve seen whether it’s a chamber stepping into introduce clean energy policy or just implementation of some sort. What are some of these innovative things that you’ve seen across the country as as people try to lean more heavily into clean energy? Yeah,

Ryan Evans 24:52
there’s, I don’t know if I can go to innovative on how chambers participate, but I can give some really Good examples of how chambers have engaged. Okay. Oh. And that’s it’s just sometimes tough because chambers are generalists for the most part, right, they need to know a lot about a lot of different industries. And so sometimes it’s really hard to dig really far into one particular topic or subject matter. But you know, in the case of chambers, one thing that we are always encouraged by is when we see coalitions of chambers that stand up for clean energy. So we’ve seen it in Ohio, when Chambers as a collective whole, all stood up and spoke out against negative anti renewable energy legislation a few years ago, in the Northeast, and now in the southeast, we’re seeing a lot of rallying by chambers to support the possibility of offshore wind development, off the coast of the East Coast. And we’re beginning to see a little bit of that in the, in the south er, in the in the south, and in the West, and the Gulf Coast and off in the Pacific Ocean, off the coast of California, and Oregon and Washington. So we see a lot of this convening and working together. We’ve seen everything from electric vehicle ride and drive and demonstrations, to clean energy industry, hosted forums and conferences, all around renewable energy and sustainability. We’ve seen energy tours. So in Utah, where I used to live, the Salt Lake chamber had few years in a row had done energy tours, where they took their members out to various energy installations. And one of them was all about clean energy, taking them to wind taken to a solar farm, etc, etc. In and, you know, clean energy, sort of a broad topic, but, and even just a couple of weeks now, the St. Pete chamber in Florida is doing a sustainability and resilience tour, they’re going to take some of their members down to see how, amongst other things, clean energy benefited certain areas to keep the lights on, as well as other resilience efforts from some of the other communities that they can bring back to St. Pete to learn from so that they are a more resilient, more resilient community for future storms. So lots of different ways that chambers have been engaged, whether it’s op eds, whether it’s events, or just, you know, fighting for good policy at a state house or the federal level.

Brandon Burton 27:29
Very good. Those are all really good examples and ways that chambers can definitely get involved. So this question may be coming from left field for you. And if you don’t want to answer it, we can edit it out. How have you seen any integration with with Bitcoin miners? And no, there’s been a lot of talk about the energy consumption of Bitcoin mining. And then Bitcoin miners trying to make the argument with clean energy and using some of these resources to offset some of those carbon emissions and whatnot. I’ll be

Ryan Evans 28:09
honest, you may want to edit this out, I don’t know Brandon, I can give a little editorial on that. It’s, it’s a tough sell, because it is high high energy usage. So we, however, did see you know, in for a little bit in Miami, we started talking about it because the local government in Miami was really trying hard to attract some Bitcoin industry there. But that energy usage was really tough, because, you know, Florida can only expand so much in terms of their energy development, their energy usage, etc. And, you know, one of the selling factors was they have such a huge nuclear, new as nuclear energy is such a huge part of their overall energy resources. And, you know, the Bitcoin it was trying to sell that, but all of that energy was already being utilized for something else. So all of this would have just been, they would have had to develop new energy. And at that point, you’ve for the most part, it’s going to make sense to build solar. So I think in general, when it comes to Bitcoin, it’s great. There is an opportunity there, but it should not be done trying to sell it as utilizing existing resources. I think in a lot of ways. If you are going to law and try to get some bitcoin manufacturing and mining going on in your communities, you really do need to look at how are we going to provide new generation to, to supply that particular operation? Yeah. All right. Well,

Brandon Burton 29:40
we’ll we’ll see what we do with that. So I’d like to ask everyone I have on the show, if there’s any tips or action items that you’d be willing to share with those listening, if they wanted to maybe get involved more with clean energy in their communities or We’re maybe something totally off topic, but for these chambers who want to take their organization up to the next level, what would you offer for them?

Ryan Evans 30:07
Thank you. Yeah, I’ve got a few things. So number one, if not every chamber is engaged in advocacy. And I understand that, at the very minimum, though Chambers as the voice of business and conveners in their community should look to be a good source of reliable information. And much like a lot of other things in the world, there’s so much misinformation put out in the world about clean energy. There are so many groups that are not local, yet, they’ll bring in people from, you know, from far away to come in and fight renewable energy projects in small communities, and make it seem like this opposition is so loud, we call them NIMBY groups, so not my backyard groups. So if nothing else, I think it’s really important that chambers look to be sources of good third party reliable expert information. So that those that actually live in the community can, you know, can really look at the facts and say, We want to make a good informed decision. So that’s, that’s sort of number one. Another just sort of tip and maybe a tidbit that I want to throw out there. There is, you know, chambers by nature tend to really love bipartisan policy. That’s sort of how we work right, we bring people together so that we can find the common ground, what’s best for the business community, what’s best for an economy, an advocate for that, whether it’s coming from the AR side, or the D side, it doesn’t really matter, we try to find the best possible policy for business businesses in our state. You know, and we certainly saw a really good example of that in the bipartisan infrastructure package that was passed two years ago, phenomenal is twice something 20 years in the making, it’s something we should all be proud of in the chamber industry that we’ve all fought for it. And that’s going to lead to everything from bridges and roads, but also to transmission lines for more utilities, for more electric vehicle charging infrastructure out there in the world as we make this transition. So there’s lots of clean energy angles on that. But the tidbit that I want to share that, yeah, I built it up to get to it. There was, you know, not a lot of chambers love the fact that the inflation Reduction Act was passed on a partisan basis. And I understand that, and I completely agree, this is a tidbit that I think is really important for people to understand. If you take away all of the other aspects of the inflation Reduction Act, and only look at the clean energy provisions within that which, you know, amounted to about a $379 billion package way, way less than what that quote unquote, green New Deal was being presented as many many years ago. But that particular legislation, just the clean energy provisions, almost every single major component of that policy has a history of bipartisan support. And a and a lot of them have a proven return on investment for that type of state tax incentive. As a lot of people say that inflation Reduction Act is really carrot heavy, and very stick light, meaning it’s all about the incentives trying to you know, trying to drive innovation and spur this new aspect to our economy, rather than penalizing and putting out more regulatory efforts that none of us really like to see in the world. So again, just I think it’s really important that something that I’ve been very passionate about is saying, if you just take out those clean energy aspects, you will see that so many of them either had bipartisan support, or suggested by and promoted by Republicans versus the Democrats that voted for the package. So really just go beyond the talking points of partisan and say, Ah, actually, there’s some really great stuff in here that’s proven value, and has proven to be supported by both sides of the aisle and people across the country.

Brandon Burton 33:56
Right. I appreciate you sharing the tips and tidbits with us there. As we look to the future of chambers, and I see a lot of the work you’re doing is future leaning. But as we look to the future of chambers, how do you see the future of chambers in their purpose going forward?

Ryan Evans 34:15
I think chambers have a more important role now than they’ve ever had before. We’ve, you know, been building up the chamber industry for 100 years, you know, over the last 10 years, I think they’ve gotten more and more influential. Really, there’s so much within the industry that’s really looking to lift up chambers, whether it’s a rural chamber, a State Chamber, a Regional Chamber, whatever it may be. But I think now is maybe more important a time than ever, because there is so much that at least that I see legislation that tends to move from state to state and Statehouse to statehouse and so it’s an opportunity not only to really stand up for your business community and those things in your state or your region that you see as important to your quality of life. But it’s, you know, it’s really this chance to look and say, Hey, what’s happening over in this state? And is that going to come to my state? Because chances are these days it is. And I bring up things in my own mind when I say this, but things like dei policies, so you know, something that the Chamber world has been super passionate about, and very much engaged in terms of advocating for more dei within their communities within their businesses and building up certification programs around Dei. Yet, in a lot of states, we’re starting to see anti from various administrations and now maybe state houses of the legislature, we’re starting to see sort of pushback on that dei work. And it’s, you know, this isn’t even in the world of clean energy for me, but it’s really important to chambers, and therefore, it’s sort of just a good example of things to look for, that you can learn from other states, what they’ve already gone through and say, Hey, is there a good chance that’s going to come to my state? And how do I either fight it off or engage it depending upon what the policy might be? How do we best represent the business community, rather than being caught off guard, let’s make sure that we’ve got our best arguments upfront and ready to go to help be, you know, again, that longtime voice of business for our community and represent our members the best we can. I

Brandon Burton 36:27
love that perspective. And that’s really one of the greatest opportunities of living in the United States is you’re able to look at other states and the models that they do and, you know, be in these individual laboratories and saying, This is what worked well there. And this is didn’t you know, and as we apply it in our communities in our state, this is why it could be good, or why it would be a disaster and really be able to make a good argument based on facts and data. So I think that’s a great perspective. Well, Ryan, this has been a for me at least, it’s been a fun conversation. It’s been an eye opening conversation, I’m sure for many, but for any listeners who wanted to reach out and connect with you to learn more about what the Chamber’s been have raised innovation and clean energy can do and, and how you can maybe work with them, what would be the best way for them to reach out and connect? hit

Ryan Evans 37:16
our website, which is ChambersforInnovation.com. Feel free to email me directly my email is revans@chambersforinnovation.com. More than happy to chat with anyone, whether it’s just a question, you want to do more, you’ve got something that you’re just not sure about whatever the case, the issue may be, and again, this can be anything from electric vehicles and electric vehicle charging, to offshore wind supply chain to solar and wind, whatever it is, if we don’t know the answer within our team, we certainly can point you in the right direction to some some great experts out there in the world, that can be a really good news resource for you.

Brandon Burton 37:57
That’s awesome. I will get that in our show notes for this episode, as well. So people can pull that up and get in contact with you. But it’s been great to have you on the podcast. Ryan, I appreciate you setting aside some time and and to share some of these insights with the Chamber champions that listen and to really help sharpen their focus on why focus on clean energy in their communities is important. So thank you for being with us today.

Ryan Evans 38:22
Thank you, Brandon. I appreciate it.

Brandon Burton 38:24
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