Below is an auto-generated transcription of my conversation with Lindsay Frilling. Because this is auto-generated there are likely some grammatical errors but it is still a useful tool to search text within this podcast episode.
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Introduction
Brandon Burton 0:00
This is the Chamber Chat Podcast, the show dedicated to chamber professionals to spark ideas and to get actionable tips and strategies to better serve your members and community.
And now, your host he thinks this is not a fun time to purchase a used car. He’s my dad Brandon Burton. Hello chamber champions.
Brandon Burton 0:23
Hello Chamber Champions. Welcome to the Chamber Chat Podcast. I’m your host Brandon Burton, and it is my goal to introduce you to people and ideas to better help you serve your Chamber members and your community.
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Guest Introduction
Our guest for today is Lindsay Frilling. Lindsay serves as the CEO for the Obion County Joint Economic Development Corporation which includes the Obion County Chamber of Commerce, and Obion County and Industrial Development Corporation. Lindsay joined the OCJEDC in 2009. Prior to joining the OCJEDC, that’s a mouthful. Lindsay was the director of marketing and special events for the Boys and Girls Club of Northwest Tennessee in Union County, and is also the former customer service supervisor for Midwest CBK. Lindsay holds a Bachelors of Science in Business Administration with a concentration in Management Information Systems from the University of Tennessee at Martin and a Master of Business Administration from UTM. Lindsay is a graduate of Tennessee chamber Institute and US Chamber Institute organization management and earned her certified economic developer designation from the International Economic Development Council. As an active member of the Tennessee Chamber of Commerce executives, Tennessee economic partnership, and Tennessee Economic Development Council. Lindsay currently serves on the board of directors of for all three organizations and was chosen for the 2016 s EDC Chairman’s Award. Lindsay is a past president of the Tennessee Chamber of Commerce executives and served on the Tennessee Chamber of Commerce and Industry board of directors. In 2015. She was named as one of West Tennessee’s up and coming top 40 under 40. Lindsay is a proud mother of two children alley, Kate and Houston.
Lindsay, I’m excited to have you with me today. You’re on Chamber Chat Podcast. And I’d love for you to take a moment to say hello to all the chamber champions that are out there listening and share something interesting about yourself so we can all get to know you a little better.
Something Interesting About Lindsay
Lindsay Frilling 3:19
Well, thanks, Brandon. I’m excited to be here today. Um, the all the exciting things you said, have a degree in it, which just kind of makes me a nerd. I guess my two kids. The fun fact about them is they’re nine years apart, really not sure why I decided to wait almost a decade. But it’s a fun ride. One went to high school and one went to preschool this year. So you know, life. Life is interesting to say the least. But you know, being in the chamber world, they are the reason I do what I do every day. So it makes life even better knowing that I’m helping to create a community in an environment that if they choose to live here, when they are old enough, then they can find a job and have a good quality of life.
Brandon Burton 4:06
Absolutely helping to build that future for the rising generation. I love it. The good news is they’re both in school now. So that’s awesome.
Lindsay Frilling 4:16
Yes, yes.
Brandon Burton 4:19
Well, share with us a little bit more about the your, your organization there kind of the size, scope, staff budget, those kinds of things to kind of set the table for our discussion today.
About the Obion County Joint Economic Development Corporation
Lindsay Frilling 4:31
Well, I’ll just say we’re in Union City. We’re in the very northwest corner of the state of Tennessee, so I’m located on the Kentucky border, almost to the Mississippi River to the Missouri Bootheel. Just to give people frame of reference, I’ll say Northwestern say they say Knoxville I’m like no West northeast, so I’m probably closer to Dallas, Texas than I am Knoxville. So two hours north of Memphis three hours west of Nashville. Three and a half hour south of St. Louis. So that kind of gives you an idea of where we’re located. Pretty much all of the Northwest Tennessee area is considered rural area. I’m about an hour from Jackson, Tennessee, and an hour from Paducah, Kentucky. So that would be your, your closest metropolitan ish areas near us. Um, my county that we serve, has a population of around 30,000. And we have myself and one other full time staff member, I have a part time staff person and currently have an intern from the University of Tennessee at Martin so to full time to part time right now. Our budget will run anywhere from 400 to $500,000 a year, we collect dues as we are a Chamber of Commerce in an Economic Development and Tourism Organization or our income comes in the form of membership dues from Chamber members, industrial members and hotel tax collections, which is really what keeps the doors open. As many of you know, memberships just really don’t give you enough money to have a good operating budget.
Brandon Burton 6:18
So that does set the table. Well, especially for our topic of discussion today being focused more around chamber financials and kind of what does it take to keep those doors open and the lights on in your office. And we will get into this discussion as soon as I get back from this quick break.
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Topic-Chamber Financials
Alright, Lindsay, we are back. So as we get into the topic today of chamber financials, I wanted to discuss this topic, specifically because we’re this time in chamber world, it seems like there’s been quite a bit of turnover with people retiring or go into the private sector. So we have a lot of new executives that are entering the chamber world space and trying to get their heads wrapped around. Yeah, the management of the office, the Chamber financials is a big, important part of that. So it’s hoping to just have a discussion around chamber financials, I know you’ve, you’ve seen kind of, you know, different ends of the spectrum when it comes to chamber financials. But I’m hoping we can get into maybe some best practices and things for these newer chamber executives to think about as they go about their budget and, and where to spend money. So maybe just as a starter, as you’re trying to get your head wrapped around what we talked about today. I know you had some reflections on on previous times. What are what’s maybe a couple lessons that you’ve learned when it comes to managing chamber financials?
Lindsay Frilling 9:12
Well, me personally, a treat it as if it’s my own money. And my first question is what I spend this if it was my money. And then the second question is, you know, obviously would would the board approve of this? And third, would it benefit my members? So first, those are just basics. You know? Unfortunately, I’ve served on boards over the years with very, very intelligent people, business people, business owners, and we get into a room and we’ll be making financial decisions for whatever organization it is, and they they make decisions and I’m thinking would you do this in your business? Would you do this with your own money? And I’m thinking No, you wouldn’t because you wouldn’t be as wealthy as you are, if you did so. I try to keep Have everything in the frame of reference of what I do it for myself, and would my members appreciate this spin or this purchase? Or, you know, whatever it is just keeping that first and foremost in whatever decision it is that’s made about money. Because I mean, as you probably have heard, involve your podcast, not many people wake up, grow up and say, oh, I want to be a chamber executive when I grew up, I mean, because most people don’t still know what a Chamber of Commerce is. So I kind of bounced around and landed into this job. And then the next thing I know, they were like, well, here are you do you do QuickBooks take care of that for us write the checks. And, and I got into it. And, of course, I fortunately had a business degree. So I knew how to read financials, I guess the first thing is, is if you don’t know how to read a profit and loss statement, or a balance sheet, go take a class, go sit down with somebody, ask somebody to help you understand those basics. I’m not to insult anybody. But you know, you’ve got to be able to know what’s coming in what’s going out and where it’s going. And then I started doing some projections as I got to look at these numbers, because I realized quickly that way more was going out and what was coming in on a monthly basis. And I finally said, Hey, by this month, six months down the road, like we’re gonna be negative, this chart is going down, up. So I was, you know, I was freaked out. I was like, I want to have a job in six months. So what are we going to do? And so that worked itself out eventually. But in the meantime, I spent the next several years just, I mean, basically saving money pinching pennies, and trying not to spend money unless it was absolutely necessary while still providing the services to our members.
Brandon Burton 11:58
So this question, maybe, kind of basic, but you had mentioned earlier on about, yeah, they’re at your organization, you have chamber work, you have Economic Development and Tourism. So you’re getting income from those different areas. And not every chamber is set up the same way. Some are just doing chamber work. Some will have an economic development contract, and some will focus more on tourism, but you’re, you know, blessed enough, if that’s the word you want to use. Three. But there are different revenue sources. So when you’re looking at projections, and you’re seeing, you know, the expenses going up, and the income, not keeping up with the expenses, besides cutting expenses, which obviously, that’s something to be looked at. What do you do as far as revenue generation? Are there maybe some thoughts around non dues revenue that a newer chamber executive maybe should consider and contemplate doing?
Lindsay Frilling 13:04
Well, I guess the first thing is, is look at what’s already being done in your chamber. And if it’s not making money, you need to get rid of it, or you need to change it, period. We don’t just because we’re called a quote, unquote, nonprofit, that’s for one day of the year, that’s when we file taxes. That’s the only day that the nonprofit status means anything. We are the voice of business as that we are the largest business in the community, we must operate like a business, everything we do must generate revenue. And that sounds very selfish, but to your question to answer that, if you’re doing things and it’s not making money, it’s not benefiting you. It’s not benefiting your members, because you’re not operating at a sustainable level. With that said, Do you offer complimentary things to your members? Absolutely. But you know, say free, you know, you know, go out and promote as oh, we’re doing this as a as a goodwill for the community. Because you can do that you can do it as an isolated event or something that you know, wraps around something else. But in the long term, whatever it is, whether you host a golf tournament, even your annual banquet, like you don’t need to lose money on those events. And the first thing you’ve got to do is make sure your board members understand that because I tell people all the time, you know, you all as the board, own this organization, I’m the hired help to make sure that I run it the way that you want it ran. So you know, you got to have those hard conversations, but if they’re on the board, that means they’re more vested in the organization than just your average member anyway, so you lean on them to lead the charge. Let them be the first ones to offer up a sponsorship or whatever it may be. Just start the generation of revenue or whatever the event is, or just a capital campaign.
Brandon Burton 15:05
And so you had mentioned, kind of the criteria that you look at the money can be treated as your own money, get to make sure the board approves the spending of the money, and does it help the members. So as you have these discussions with a board, whether it’s you or chamber executive listening, looking to have a conversation, one of these tough conversations, any any advice on how to help them navigate, kind of the difficult conversation that may come up from time to time,
Lindsay Frilling 15:38
um, you it, find a mentor, find somebody to have this conversation with first, somebody else, probably best to find somebody geographically located near you. Because in this area where we live, our county mayors talk to the next county mayor or the next city mayor or the next elected official or the next board chair, like they’re always talking. So you know, the best thing to do is find out what’s happening around you figure out how they have the conversations, figure out how money is spent, how boards operate, I mean, and and I say it all the time chambers are like fruit, but we’re all different fruit, apples, or just bananas, because every chamber operates differently because your chamber has to operate to fit your community. And just because your community sits next door to another one, doesn’t mean you’re going to have the same needs. And I mean, we’re we have a huge tourism draw, we have Discovery Park of America and Reelfoot Lake. And then you know, the next community down may not have those assets. So we have to tailor our programs and services to fit the community. So find somebody close to you, but also find somebody similar to you another chamber or chamber Exec. I’m a firm believer in mentorship and ask questions, ask questions, ask questions, because you know, r&d in this world is rip off and duplicate what’s working over there, and you think it’s gonna work for you scale it up, scale it down, put it in place, give it a try. And you know, find a champion, find a champion for your chamber, find a personal champion for you, and have that volunteer by your side. Because, you know, the first role of the chamber world is keep a volunteer between you in the issue. And that issue is always money, whether it’s a positive issue or a negative issue, it’s always an issue. So, you know, find somebody close that you can keep as your champion, whether it be your current president or somebody else on the board, but you’ve got to have a mentor, you’ve got to have a volunteer, you got to have people around you because you cannot do this work on your own.
Brandon Burton 17:58
Absolutely. I love that. That advice of having a mentor specifically someone within your region because your state your region, it’s going to vary from you know, a chamber in California to a chamber in Maine is going to be very different. So find out some of those best practices in your area. One thing I wanted to ask you about as as far as like income to expense, during the COVID pandemic, we realized how important it was for a chamber to have reserves. You know, when when PvP loans are going out and and chamber most chambers didn’t qualify? How do you look at income versus income to expense and specifically, setting aside reserves that kind of that rainy day fund?
Lindsay Frilling 18:45
Well, as I said, I’ve served on a lot of boards and different capacities in generally, the best practice that we aim for, is keep a reserve of half of an annual costs. So whatever your annual budget is, have your goal is to set aside half of that. Now, Is that realistic for everybody? Absolutely not. But, you know, it gives you six months of time should something, you know, catastrophic occur. So that’s just generally what I have seen. Again, that number could fluctuate up and down, depending on the type of organization you have. But, you know, people want to tell you three months, but in reality, how quickly does three months go by when you’re in the middle of a crisis? I mean, six is going to go pretty quickly, but at least you’ve got double that amount of time, if you can, if you can aim to, you know, put back at least half of your operating budget for the year.
Brandon Burton 19:50
Yeah, I think for me, it goes back to treating it as your own money. So if you look at your own personal finances, right, the recommendation is save for a rainy day right? If If you were to go unemployed for some period of time, maybe it’s ideally and I hear different numbers. But you know, some people will say try to have a year’s worth of savings. And that’s not feasible when you’re just starting, right? If you’re starting from zero, but you build up to it, right. So whether it’s a percentage each, each month that you’re putting aside or whatever, you got to start somewhere
Lindsay Frilling 20:24
in savings should be a part of your budget, just with your business, just as it should be with your personal income. And as you said, I would much rather have six months of my personal expenses than three, but if I’m going to go to six, you know what, I’m going to go to 12, I’m going to get there. So nothing’s to keep you from raising the bar, once you hit that 50% to just keep on going, you know, and putting it into investing it, you know, letting it make money for you. So that, you know, down the road, your chamber is sustainable, and you don’t have to go through the struggles of you know, where we’re going to get our next meal. I mean, you know, that’s reality for a lot of chambers. But it doesn’t have to be if you know, you try to put all of these puzzle pieces together. I mean, it’s not going to happen quickly. I’ve been at this 12 years. And I will say that it probably hasn’t been until the last two to three years that I’ve actually felt comfortable about our finances.
Brandon Burton 21:26
Wow, that says a lot what these last two to three years have been. So yeah, well, let’s say if you could tell us a little bit more about that. He’s the had mentioned about investing those reserves. Just for, say a new executive, is that something a chamber can do? What options are there? Who should they talk to what what would be your thoughts?
Lindsay Frilling 21:50
We have in the past, we’ve had CDs, we’ve had that money put into CDs at certain rates, we’ve had it small CDs, large CDs, we’ve had different funding financial funds. With that, I mean, again, that’s going to go back to your chamber your board. Right now, my board chairman is a CPA, so I pretty well have a sweet deal going on when it comes to that. So he’s very helpful. But again, in within your community, reach out, utilize those resources, utilize those members that you have asked for a meeting and go ask that question, say, would you even if they’re not on your board, would you be willing to sit down and look at this budget with me? And help me go through this? Give me your thoughts, because you know, they’re the experts. Chamber execs are generalist, we know, we know a whole lot about a lot of things. But we’re not necessarily experts in any one thing. And generally not financials we need to be I mean, I’ve made it a goal over the years for that to be my forte, I want to know everything about my budget inside and out. But I didn’t come into it that way. I’ve just learned and asked questions. And, you know, being almost broke at one time, helped me get there a lot more quickly than most people. But my I definitely, definitely recommend contacting your local members and just asking for 30 minutes of their time to sit down and say, Hey, what do we do? How do we look? And if we wanted to get to X amount of savings, then what what can we do with it because you know, what we do in the chamber world is manage expectations every day. And if we can set that goal and cast that vision of, hey, we want to have this amount of income each month, we want to save this much each month, we want to get to this much in savings. And then once we get there, we want to put it in invest it here or put it over here and let this money make money for us.
Brandon Burton 24:03
I think that is a wise piece of advice. I don’t hear a whole lot of chambers talk about that. So I’m glad to have you gone a little deeper about investing some of those reserves. Are there certain metrics? Maybe the look at his you look at it. Well, maybe let me back up. profit and loss statements. How often should you be looking at over?
Lindsay Frilling 24:30
I reconcile ours monthly, and some chambers wait and get audited annually. And then you know, if there was a discrepancy, you won’t find it for 12 months, three months, whatever timeframe. And, I mean, I again at home, I’m not going to wait 12 months to look at my balance in my checking account. So why would I do that at work? So I literally You know, write checks, pay bills make deposits throughout the month, but at the end of the month, I sit down, reconcile it and QuickBooks, send it to the accountant and they put their stamp on it every single month. And it keeps us because it’s essentially, the way it’s set up. It’s essentially as we’re getting audited every single month, so that we’re not going through and paying for a massive audit once a year, it’s literally getting their stamp every single month. And if you’re not doing it, at least monthly, you should be.
Brandon Burton 25:36
And it gives you a good pulse to as to the healthier chamber, the financial health of your chamber, where things are at, if there needs to be adjustments made, you’re not waiting till the end of the year, it’s easier to make small adjustments along the way to get to that end goal. Well, and
Lindsay Frilling 25:51
we’re a chamber that collects days, once a year, I know there are chambers that lets you come in and pay as you go, which is fine. But for accounting purposes, it’s just easier for us to bill in July, the beginning of our fiscal year, and then spend, you know, three months that window of time collecting the money and bringing it in. Now it makes it tough because toward getting closer to June, you have less income. So your p&l doesn’t look as healthy as it does in July, August, September. But again, that’s what a budget is for, you know what to expect throughout the year, you know, who’s going to renew and how much you’re going to have pretty much the first quarter of your calendar year, what are your fiscal year, whatever that is. And then as people join throughout the year, we just prorate their days, whatever right that is. And then we bill everybody in July. Again, what works for you is on you. But like it keeps us from having somebody having to manage that piece of our budget in our organization every month. I mean, it just, you know when you have and 5060 members may seem tiny to some people. But imagine if you have 2030 4050 of those a month, and you’re sending out invoices every single month, I mean, ah, my personal opinion is prorate those days, get them all done at once. And that way you kind of know, early on in your year, what’s your incomes gonna be, especially if your chambers are your sole source of income?
Brandon Burton 27:31
I like that. And obviously, every chamber is different. So they’re gonna approach it differently. But as you look over your your p&l, are there certain, certain indicators that you look at to kind of measure the health of your organization?
Lindsay Frilling 27:46
Well, you know, there’s so many numbers and percentages out there about what your your salary and compensation percentage should be of total revenue. And I’ve looked ACC has information, your State Chamber will have information. And, you know, unfortunately, and this is really difficult for people that are looking to outsiders that look at your budget to understand that we don’t we don’t make a product, we don’t make widgets. So our biggest expense is our people, it’s going to be in payroll and salary. And when people look at your budget, and they see that it’s over 50% of what’s going out the door. Some people really you know, are taken aback by that. But you have to just again, manage that expectation and say, We are a service organization, we are marketing, we are everything except for creating a product. So we don’t have any necessarily raw materials going into our process and into our budget that we’re paying for. We’re paying for talent. And that’s probably the biggest line item that you’re going to have to overcome in the chamber world that and travel because if you’re not out traveling and interacting with others, you know that some of the best things that I’ve learned as a chamber exec has come from other chamber execs, networking with those executives, attending conferences, attending trainings, Tennessee has an awesome Institute, a two year program that’s, you know, a couple of days long, I did that and then transitioned right into the US Chamber Institute, but it’s expensive, you know, so that can be kind of a line item that sticks out in your education and your travel expenses. Again, you’ve got those two just tied directly back into what I was talking about your people your talent, and if you’re not investing in your talent, you’re going to lose your talent. And again, I’ll go back and say it all day. Long we need to operate as a business and how many businesses do you know that do not invest in their people? I mean, if they’re not, then they’re probably not going to make it.
Brandon Burton 30:11
And to your point, if you were making widgets, you should be looking at ways to source better materials or better logistics for distribution, and you’re putting money into that to get a better return. And when your core product is your people, you got to put the money into them to make them better, to better serve.
Lindsay Frilling 30:30
And if you you know, a lot of chambers can’t pay at the pay scale that your businesses can they should be. I mean, that’s a conversation I have a lot. I’m like, if we’re representing business, we need to be hiring like a business, we need to be paying like a business, we need to be compensating like a business. And I wouldn’t have said that 10 years ago, because I didn’t have the money to do it. But you know, now we’re there. And I’m like, we are a business, there’s no reason to keep saying, Oh, your nonprofit, you can’t pet Yes, you should be able to is numb people should always be number one. And in everything you’re thinking about as a chamber, internally and externally. But it’s got to start from within. Because if you’re not taking care of your people inside, they’re not going to go out and take care of your members, businesses outside. I mean, I literally hire people for passion. And then I can teach them how to do it, because I can’t teach them to care. I can’t make them care. And if they don’t care about people, and they don’t care about the community, they don’t need to be at a Chamber of Commerce. Right? Sure. Well, so being able to allow them to go travel and network and get training to me is a little can add to that overall compensation package. Job.
Brandon Burton 31:52
So everyone listening needs to take like the last four or five minutes and send it to your board. Just a little friendly. Listen, you know, this is this is coming from a you know, well respected chamber executive. Yeah, it just, it’s not coming from you individually. So just a friendly tip there. But
Lindsay Frilling 32:14
say it all the time. You can, I can say it all day. But if I just bring somebody else in to say it, you know, it becomes gospel. So you know, yeah, use my words. It’s fun, it won’t be the first time.
Brandon Burton 32:25
Yeah. So as we start wrapping up here, I’d like to ask if you have any, maybe a tip or action item, the chair for anyone listening that they can do to help take their chamber up to the next level.
Action Item/Tip for Chamber Champions
Lindsay Frilling 32:38
As I said, Go to chamber Institute, whether it’s state level US Chamber Institute, invest in yourself, invest in your people, get a mentor, two or three of those, always keep a volunteer between you and the issue. Be authentic, and don’t accept the invitation to every argument you’re invited to attend. Because the Chamber’s you know, it’s fun when it’s fun. But then when it’s bad, we tend to get all we get, we don’t get the credit, we always get the blame. And I just always, always tell my people when you know, Facebook, or whatever, people are being negative, you know, just consider the source know that what you’re doing is good. And if you’re doing it right, you’re laying your head down at night, and you can sleep and just let the rest of it go.
Brandon Burton 33:30
Yeah, that’s good. So as we look to the future of chambers, how do you see the future of chambers and their purpose going forward?
Future of Chambers
Lindsay Frilling 33:39
We’re always going to be the voice of business. And business is driven by people. So it’s always going to be about people, whether it’s in education, workforce development, entrepreneurship, whatever we can do to help people is always it always has been, and it’s always going to be where we go. So I think it just goes back to what I said earlier, you got to care about your people, you got to care about your community, and you got to hire staff that have the same thoughts and feelings about it. And then you help others whether whether it’s the economic development organization, the Tourism Organization, Main Street, downtown organizations, just make yourself the hub of the community when somebody wants to know something or needs to know something, make them think I’m going to call the chamber.
Brandon Burton 34:30
That’s right. And you know, most responses I get to that question are pretty similar, but I love just kind of hammering that home, you know that chambers are about people. And the feature of chambers is about strengthening your communities and making your communities better. And those responses I get come from all different points of view. So I hope it’ll continue to resonate with everyone listening and really getting that sense of the purpose of what chambers are all about. But Lindsey Before we let you go, I wanted to give you an opportunity to share any contact information for anyone listening who might want to reach out and connect with you what would be the best way for them to reach out and do that,
Connect with Lindsay Frilling
Lindsay Frilling 35:10
um, you can reach me my cell phone number is 731-592-1083 which is the best way because as you know, for sitting behind a desk, we’re not being very effective for our community. So that is my cell phone number. My email is lindsay@obioncounty.org and you can always find us online.
Brandon Burton 35:46
Awesome. I will get all that in our show notes for this episode, which will be at chamberchatpodcast.com/episode156. But Lindsay, thank you for spending time with me today here on Chamber Chat Podcast. I think the perspective that you brought and and just experience around chamber financials is very helpful for those who are just getting their, their feet wet. And really, you know, I’m going to reiterate it you know, get a mentor. Get with people in your region, your communities, neighboring communities and see what they’re doing and and learn from others. So, thank you for that, Lindsay. And it’s been a pleasure chatting with you.
Lindsay Frilling 36:28
You too. Thank you so much for having me.
Brandon Burton 30:28
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